Are Genos 2 styles bang up to date for modern tunes.

[Ron]

I find that the limiting factor with Yamaha keyboards is that the stock styles do not keep up with modern music. More styles are added with every new model release but the content still tends to favour old and mostly favourites from yesteryear.  How is Yamaha going to persuade young players to purchase a keyboard on which most of the styles relate to tunes that they do not even know?  To be fair, the majority of modern pop music is unplayable to most people but how can a young up and coming musician be expected to buy an expensive " band in a box" keyboard which does not cater for modern tastes.  This does not affect me or most of the players that I know as we are all deeply rooted in the music of years gone by and I only have a Tyros 3 but still manage to find built in styles for the sort of music I like to play. It is possible to create one's own styles but this needs knowledge and experience which would not automatically be available to most players.  Styles can also be bought or downloaded from various forums etc but if I was now starting from scratch I would choose a keyboard which was not classed as a work station but meant to be played as a musical instrument.  No styles available if using this route but if playing in a band, as I used to do, then built in styles are not needed.  Any thoughts on this topic?

[DrakeM]

I am not sure what you are calling music of today.

If it is hip hop ... I think that music is all one chord songs with just different drum patterns changing during the song.

Pop music is just repeating the same lyric line 3 or more times in a row, add one verse and repeat until you have a 3 to 4 minute vocal take.

With today's country music you can use your 26 country styles and steal parts from your Pop&Rock, R&B and Ballad styles to make styles to fit what they are calling today's country music.

All the parts are contained in the styles, you just need to move stuff around to make styles for what ever you want. 

[mikf]

Why do retirement homes not have hip hop playing on the background music, or a video games gallery. If they did they might attract a lot more young people to stay there😏
Yamaha know the market for these instruments. As they know the market for all the instruments they sell.
Mike

[chesterkins]

I mentioned this in an earlier thread   
In Genos 2 there were basically NO new Dance styles BUT a lot of new styles from the 80's
So yes Yamaha know the age range they are targeting

[Divemaster]

Why do retirement homes not have hip hop playing on the background music, or a video games gallery. If they did they might attract a lot more young people to stay there😏
Yamaha know the market for these instruments. As they know the market for all the instruments they sell.
Mike

As a registered carer, I think as you get older, and your joints start to give out, your eyesight starts to deteriorate, and your memory starts to fade, ANY music is very welcome.

You won't be HIP HOPPING anywhere my friend.

It's called Old Age!

Keith

[EileenL]

I find Yamaha Keyboards have there fair share of head banging styles Plus the DJ ones that are suitable for todays so called music.

[Rick D.]

Ron,

I don't think young people have $5500 to spend on a keyboard and besides that there is not too much new music out there worthy of it's on Style.

I am still holding off on the Genos 2, I will likely make my move in the fall as I normally wait a year after the release of a new keyboard to see popular opinion and until they get the bugs worked out. Also the price will come down a bit. This strategy has worked for the last twenty years.

Rick D.

[EileenL]

We have been lucky with Genos2 No real bugs and have only had one update so I am well pleased with mine.

[pjd]

Why do retirement homes not have hip hop playing on the background music, or a video games gallery. If they did they might attract a lot more young people to stay there😏
Yamaha know the market for these instruments. As they know the market for all the instruments they sell.
Mike

Mike is right on. EDM, hip hop, etc. are an afterthought on Genos/PSR. The few styles are there in case a performer gets a request at a wedding reception or whatever.

Yamaha makes instruments which are targeted at contemporary genres -- the Montage/MODX synths and now the SEQTRAK groove box. The SEQTRAK is styled like the popular Teenage Engineering products and is teen-to-twenties affordable: $399 USD (MAP/street). The workflow and companion app support the "beat-making" production process.

As to musical genres, I'm not about to yell "Get off of my lawn" at anybody. 

Peace and playing -- pj

[pjd]

BTW, if anyone wants additional hip-hop or whatever DJ styles, I converted DJX-II patterns to DJ styles:

https://sandsoftwaresound.net/free-djx-ii-styles-version-2/

Download 'em. They're free.

All the best -- pj

[Jørgen]

BTW, if anyone wants additional hip-hop or whatever DJ styles, I converted DJX-II patterns to DJ styles:

https://sandsoftwaresound.net/free-djx-ii-styles-version-2/

Download 'em. They're free.

All the best -- pj

Hi
Link does not work here---
Jørgen

[KurtAgain]

Hi
Link does not work here---
Jørgen

I have no problems with the link.

[DrakeM]

When go to the web site page and I click on the "Click on this link to download the ZIP file."

In the download ICON there is a message that shows up and reads:
File not downloaded: Potential Security Risk.  (in RED lettering)

BUT the file does download. 

[overover]

Hi
Link does not work here---
Jørgen

Hi Jørgen,

This is a "http://..." link (maybe a typo). Just right-click to copy the link address, paste it into your browser's address bar and change the protocol "http://..." to "https://...". Then the download shoud work.


Best regards,
Chris

[pjd]

This is a "http://..." link (maybe a typo). Just right-click to copy the link address, paste it into your browser's address bar and change the protocol "http://..." to "https://...". Then the download shoud work.

Chris is correct -- thanks, Chris!

Grrrrr.     My site is riddled with links to older content and Wordpress doesn't automatically update such links to "https://" .

I changed the link to the ZIP file to begin with "https://". Please test the new link and let me know if there are still issues.

Sorry for the bother, but browsers have gotten a lot pickier since I first posted this content.

All the best -- pj

P.S. Thanks for visiting the site and reporting issues!

[DrakeM]

You have it fixed up perfect now. No issues at all. 

[Jørgen]

....
Sorry for the bother, but browsers have gotten a lot pickier since I first posted this content.

All the best -- pj

P.S. Thanks for visiting the site and reporting issues!

Thanks for the explanation and the fix.
Should have figured it myself...
Regards
Jørgen

[Ron]

Thanks guys for hijacking my post into a completely different topic.

Hip-hop is so called ultra modern music and is not what I was referring to in my post.  Yamaha marketing and development is not trying to capture young musicians into purchasing a Genos 2.

When was the last time you saw a Genos being played in a modern music group?  We are all prisoners of the "style " system and cannot play certain tunes unless there is a matching style.  This was the point I was trying to make about Yamaha not being up to date with their latest keyboards.   How many owners use this particular keyboard to play in a band unless using it simply as a synth to add extra instruments to the overall band sound.  It does suit people like myself as a home player and also those that play as a self contained music entertainer, either with vocals or not, for care centres, retiral homes etc.  But we are all getting older.  How will Yamaha maintain a market share of keyboards unless they modernise the scope of their popular machines to try and attract younger customers who have never even heard most of the material that we all are currently playing.  Personally, I have played a few more modern tunes but found that most did not appreciate my efforts, mainly due to them never listening to modern music.

So, I must accept the status quo and leave the situation as it now stands.  But surely food for thought for the future?
I should add that this is my own personal view on the current status of Yamaha arranger keyboards and is no way meant to be confrontational as I am more than satisfied with my dated Tyros 3.

Ron

[DerekA]

A while ago I was speaking with someone who has some involvement with developing content for the Yamaha arrangers. He said that the preset styles, etc, tend to reflect music up to about 20-30 years ago, since this is the music that the target market is most likely to be comfortable with. And I think that's generally true.

[DrakeM]

You can get all these keyboards to play anything you want. The styles are just the BUILDING BLOCKS you can use to create with. Of course if you have more money than time you can purchase your styles from vendors on the internet.

Here are all the songs I play at my Senior Center gigs that came out since 2010:

Song Title                        Year
Tequila Little Time                   21
One Margarita                    20
Beer Can't Fix                           20
Mr. Lonely                           19
1, 2, Many                           19
Beer Never Broke My Heart   19
Every Little Honky Tonk Bar   19
Millionaire                           18
Must Be the Whiskey           18
Don't Let the Old Man In           18
Down to the Honky Tonk           18
I'll Name the Dogs                   17
Drinking Problem                   17
Outta Style                           16
Head Over Boots                   16
Blue Ain't Your Color           16
Burn Out                                   16
Sangria                                   15
Tennessee Whiskey           15
Buscuits                                   15
Come A Little Bit Closer           15
Meanwhile Back at Mama's   14
My Eyes                                   14
Neon Light                           14
Southern Girl                           13
From Here to the Moon and Back   13
All Over the Road                   13
Boys Round Here                   13
Death of a Single Man           13
Southern Comfort Zone           12
This Ole Boy                           12
Time Is Love                           12
Wagon Wheel                           12
Lovin' You Is Fun                   12
Give It All We Got Tonight   12
Who Are You When I'm Not Looking   11
Kiss Me or Not                           11
Love Done Gone                   11
Red Solo Cup                           11
Honey Bee                           11
Drink In My Hand                   11
Why Don't We Just Dance   10
Pretty Good At Drinkin' Beer   10
A Little More Country Than That   10

I'd do more newer songs if they would record decent Country Music. It's not the keyboard that is the PROBLEM ... it's the MUSIC INDUSTRY. 

Drake

[BogdanH]

hi Ron,
I agree with what you say, however here you contradict yourself a little:

..
How will Yamaha maintain a market share of keyboards unless they modernise the scope of their popular machines to try and attract younger customers...
...Personally, I have played a few more modern tunes but found that most did not appreciate my efforts, mainly due to them never listening to modern music...

-so why would Yamaha even bother with "modern" music/styles, if most (our listeners) don't appreciate it?

I think, that even if there would be content/styles for hip-hop (or whatever "modern" music) on keyboard, then that wouldn't change a thing... because we, one-man-band keyboard players, don't have such audience: who would listen to our playing? Who would dance on our music?

Let's say we play at some party (audience age is irrelevant) and we wish to move people to start dancing. In this case we will most probably have more success by playing "good old" Wooly Bully than with some hip-hop or techno music.

We had some "modern" music in past 20-30 years and most is already forgotten... and those who are listening/dancing to it right now, will forget it as well as they become just a bit older ...let's say over 25 

That is, I'm quite happy with capability of current keyboards. Ok, I wish that preset styles would be improved.. for example, it's so boring listening bass guitar playing only C-G notes.

Just my opinion,
Bogdan

[DrakeM]

Here is even me playing some of these songs live with my keyboard

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGTQ_9MilKk&list=PLOyNsYk1KSHi9fWiMRoA1ZsF-VvI2plDC

You can compare how close the styles is to the record. I just need to sing the songs in MY KEY and not the KEY of the song's artist.
Other than that it's so close that YOU TUBE sends me a notice that this is copyrighted material but the artist allows usage on YOU TUBE.

Drake

[bpsafran]

The interesting discussion here involves modern
songs.  But arrangers can also be used for orchestral
music production and performance.  That includes,
some classical music (usually .light classics) and
many movie themes. Both.of these are not on the
latest pop charts, but have stood the test of time.
I think arrangers have great educational potential
in teaching the structures  harmonies and rhythms of
all types of music, from the latest pop to the classics and.
movies.  There is so much.musiic built-in to the arranger
styles if one uses them as a learning and teaching tool by listening and analyzing (and then playing, even for fun).⁰

[mikf]

Ron
Arrangers seldom get played in bands of any kind, because they are not really the right instrument for that purpose. You can of course use it as a simple keyboard in a band without playing styles but that is rare.  And if it was used that way, the styles don't  matter as you would not use them anyway. So if I am playin* in a band, I would not be buying an arranger.
Arrangers are primarily marketed for home use, a sub set is gigging as a OMB. They are not designed or marketed to bands and groups. Yamaha has a whole range of products for that purpose.
Yamaha are not stupid, they know what the market is, and provide a set of styles they know sells these arranger keyboards. I don't understand why people keep thinking that Yamaha  is getting this wrong and missing a whole potential market. Yamaha knows exactly who they sell arrangers to, who they sell synths to, and why.
And if you don't like what styles Yamaha supply, there are lots of independent style makers where you can buy them, or you can make your own.
Mike

[DrakeM]

Live bands today do use arrangers and they use them more and more every year it seems.

They however called them TRACKS that they are playing along with ("Tomayto, Tomahto" as they say).

Drake

[pjd]

I find that the limiting factor with Yamaha keyboards is that the stock styles do not keep up with modern music. More styles are added with every new model release but the content still tends to favor old and mostly favorites from yesteryear.

Hi Ron --

If you classify hip-hop as "ultra modern" and not relevant to your point, I'm left confused. Exactly what "modern" styles are you looking for?

BTW, I first heard early hip-hop blasting out of a boombox, riding on a bus in Cleveland -- 1983. Ummm, 40 years ago? 

I agree with Mike. Yamaha use content -- like styles -- to sell into specific market segments as defined by age and region (to say the least). The SEQTRAK beatbox is targeted at a very different market segment than arranger keyboards, for example. so are pianos... 

One exception where there is overlap is the PSR-E473 with its Groove Creator and an actual SAMPLER. Maybe the hope is to coerce young people into music lessons.    "Groove Creator" is the new name for "DJ", which is now un-hip.

Yamaha will adapt.

Take care (didn't mean to hijack the thread) -- pj

[Curry Noodle]

Clearly not.

While appreciating that styles are 'just building blocks', the range is pretty poor and uninspiring.

How can a creative musician in 2024 possibly be inspired by the plethora of Umpah, Umpah, cha-cha, Schlager, Polka, Oberkrainer, time warped 'classics', most of which are barely distinguishable from each other. And how many Waltz's do you actually need!!!

Genos is supposed to be a Creative Workstation and Arranger, not a glorified karaoke machine that's best suited to retirement home get-togethers.   

What's missing is a proper representation of major influencers and popular cultural icons: Bowie, Pink Floyd, Genesis, Prince, Madonna, Black Eyed Peas, Yes, Ed Sheran, Led Zeplin.. etc etc etc etc. and as such Yamaha has been, and continues to be, missing quite a trick.

     

   

[Amwilburn]

Genos is supposed to be a Creative Workstation and Arranger, not a glorified karaoke machine that's best suited to retirement home get-togethers.   

What's missing is a proper representation of major influencers and popular cultural icons: Bowie, Pink Floyd, Genesis, Prince, Madonna, Black Eyed Peas, Yes, Ed Sheran, Led Zeplin.. etc etc etc etc. and as such Yamaha has been, and continues to be, missing quite a trick.

?
There are styles for 3 Madonna songs, 2 Prince songs, 2 Ed Sheeran, 1 Led Zeppelin (Kashmir), 1 Black eyed Peas (I've got a Feeling), not to mention at least a couple of Queen Songs (found 3 so far), Supertramp, Van Halen, Elton John...

Didn't find Genesis (yet), but there are a Peter Gabriel, and quite a few Phil Collins songs though!
I didn't find any Bowie or Pink Floyd, no. But maybe those who are more familiar with their catalogs could help?

Mark

[ikmusic]

I say that there is no arranger on the market that has as many contemporary styles as Yamaha! 

[orangeman]

I know we are talking about built in styles, but I'm a huge fan of this site which has incredible and detailed styles. By far the best I've ever used.

https://www.styles4k.com/

Pink Floyd, Genesis, Madonna, Dire Straits, Fleetwood Mac, etc. all done at the very highest level.