Using midi control files while recording

Fred Smith · May 05, 2020, 05:15:19 PM

I use midi files to control the sheet music on my iPad, mostly because I can use them to change the page.

Things are great until I try to record a song. Then I don't get the page turned, presumably because the channel is being used for recording.

I tried turning off the recording of the channel the midi file is using, but that didn't help.

So I'm thinking I might be able to do something via the Midi Setup. Currently I'm using All Parts. Is there a setup I can create which would allow me to record all channels, and transmit on one of them during the recording? Alternatively, I could live with recording 15 channels if I could transmit on the other one.

Thanks for your help,
Fred

overover · May 05, 2020, 05:31:32 PM

Hi Fred,

do you use Songbook+ on your iPad, and is your (only) keyboard from which you want to control Songbook+ the GENOS?

Best regards,
Chris

Fred Smith · May 05, 2020, 05:56:09 PM

Quote from: overover on May 05, 2020, 05:31:32 PM
do you use Songbook+ on your iPad, and is your (only) keyboard from which you want to control Songbook+ the GENOS?

Yes and yes.

Thanks,
Fred

overover · May 05, 2020, 07:19:53 PM

Hi Fred,

I guess you took over the control MIDI files ("dummy files") method from an earlier keyboard model (e.g. Tyros5). At that time, this was the only way to send control commands to SB+ when switching Registrations.

With the Genos (and the PSR-SX models) there is now a much more elegant method (which even works automatically in BOTH directions). Sy*** is used for control here, and you don't need control MIDI files anymore. But don't worry, in connection with SB+ everything is very easy:

First call up the desired Registration bank on the Genos and, if desired, activate a specific Registration in this bank.

In SB+ first open the MIDI settings (once) and set "Easy Keyboard Settings> Control Mode" to "YAMAHA Genos PSR-SX900 / 700 Registrations (with link)". Then touch outside of the Settings area to save your changes.

Now call up the desired "song" in SB+ and touch the ••• icon in the status bar. Then touch on "Yamaha Keyboard Link >>> Now link the song".

That's all

. Now you can call up this "Song" in SB by selecting the corresponding Reg Bank (or Registration) and vice versa (!)

Please refer to this special manual from BauM Software:

>>> https://www.baum-software.ch/downloads/OtherManuals/Manual_Yamaha_Genos_SongBook.pdf

Important: Please follow the advice on page 11 that the switch "Send MIDI command on open" must be disabled in your songs.

Regarding your original request for MIDI files:

You can link only ONE MIDI file per Registration. IF you use a Song MIDI file you cannot use a Control MIDI file at the same time. In this a case you would have to write the control commands for SB+ into the Song MIDI file (on the first "tick" 001: 1: 000). This could be done e.g. B. with MixMaster or directly in the Genos under "MIDI Multirecording - Step Recording".

(I would have to explain many more steps here ...)

All in all, this "old" method is relatively complex to use, because you would have to edit all song MIDI files. Ideally, Channel 1 is not used for Song data, but then you can no longer use the MIDI Quick Recording method (or you would have to move Channel 1, which is normally used for Right 1, to another Channel).

(And, when it comes to calling up Regs from SB +, all the Reg banks used (max. 500) had to be in one single folder.)

My recommendation to you is therefore to switch completely to the NEW method I described above, then you have no such limitations anymore. It is completely independent of using Song MIDI files in Registrations, and you do not need to change your usual methods for recording MIDI files (MIDI Quick Recording / MIDI Multi Recording).

Hope this helps!

Best regards,
Chris

Fred Smith · May 05, 2020, 08:37:00 PM

Hi Chris,

I realize there's a new method of linking registrations to Songbook, but it doesn't work for me because there's no way to turn the page. That's why I stuck with the old method.

Regarding my midi issue, I'm not asking to use more than one midi file in a registration.

I want to:
-- Keep my registrations as is (ie, with the control file I need)
-- While using the registration, record a midi song.

While I'd like to record all 16 channels, I can live with recording only 15 channels if that would solve my problem. I still think a special midi setup would do the trick, but up till now, I haven't been able to figure it out.

Thanks for your help,
Fred

overover · May 06, 2020, 04:22:22 AM

Quote from: Fred Smith on May 05, 2020, 08:37:00 PM
Hi Chris,

I realize there's a new method of linking registrations to Songbook, but it doesn't work for me because there's no way to turn the page. That's why I stuck with the old method.

Hi Fred,

please allow this additional question: In which way do you currently "turn the page" in SB+? Are you using different "Songs" which are linked to several Registrations of a Bank?

Quote from: Fred Smith on May 05, 2020, 08:37:00 PM

Regarding my midi issue, I'm not asking to use more than one midi file in a registration.

I want to:
-- Keep my registrations as is (ie, with the control file I need)
-- While using the registration, record a midi song.

While I'd like to record all 16 channels, I can live with recording only 15 channels if that would solve my problem. I still think a special midi setup would do the trick, but up till now, I haven't been able to figure it out. ...

I don't know exactly what you mean by that. Why can't you record a MIDI file in the "normal" way while using Registrations in which control MIDI files are used? The made changes in MIDI setup to can work with SB+ do not affect the recording or playback of a MIDI song internally in Genos. So, the MIDI setup only affect external MIDI Devices.

The changed MIDI setup can only be a problem if you want to play back a MIDI file internally and transmit the Song MIDI data to record it externally (e.g. on a DAW). Please tell me again, what exactly is your problem in this context.

Best regards,
Chris

Fred Smith · May 06, 2020, 10:05:24 AM

Quote from: overover on May 06, 2020, 04:22:22 AM
please allow this additional question: In which way do you currently "turn the page" in SB+? Are you using different "Songs" which are linked to several Registrations of a Bank?

I don't know exactly what you mean by that. Why can't you record a MIDI file in the "normal" way while using Registrations in which control MIDI files are used? The made changes in MIDI setup to can work with SB+ do not affect the recording or playback of a MIDI song internally in Genos. So, the MIDI setup only affect external MIDI Devices.

The changed MIDI setup can only be a problem if you want to play back a MIDI file internally and transmit the Song MIDI data to record it externally (e.g. on a DAW). Please tell me again, what exactly is your problem in this context.

Hi Chris,

Thanks for your reply.

I change the page in the same manner as loading the pdf. I have a midi file which sends a NextPage command to SongBook.

My problem is that when I'm recording, and I get to the point in the song where I want to turn the page, the NextPage command isn't being sent.

I'm assuming it's because the channel being used for transmission (#1) is busy recording. But even if I turn off the recording for channel 1, it still doesn't work.

Is transmitting disabled during recording?

Cheers,
Fred

vlbrgt · May 06, 2020, 10:27:05 AM

Fred,

I dont't think that it is possible to play a midi file and record a midi file at the same time.
That is my experience.
I also use a midi file when playing (to have the score on the Genos screen), but doing that I can not record a midi file at the same time.

Regards
Etienne

repetedj · July 29, 2020, 11:56:55 PM

Not sure if this will work. I have a T5.
Record the song and save it.(All channels)
Determine the Bar that you want to turn the page.
On the T5(I know you have a Genos) go into Song Creator
Tab over to the 1-16 tab.
Select channel one.
Page down to the bar you want the page turned. Insert the midi next page command(s) to turn the page.
Press the Execute button and then the Save button to save the midi song file.
Load the song you just saved back in.
Start the song to see if it works.
Hope this helps.

Fred Smith · July 30, 2020, 06:59:30 AM

Yes, that works AFTER I have recorded the sing.

But how do I turn the pare WHILE recording the song?

Cheers,
Fred

repetedj · July 31, 2020, 04:09:53 PM

Fred,

Are you now using a pedal to turn the page?
Again, I'm not sure of this.
If the pedal is a midi pedal, would you be able to press the pedal at the time you want the page turned so that the pedal sends the page command into the KB while recording and the command gets recorded. The pedal would be linked to your KB instead of the IPAD.

You would have to know (or configure the pedal) the command the pedal sends. Then you might be able to have the software on the IPAD recognize that command to turn the page.

Once again, I'm not sure about this as I do not have the same setup you do.

Fred Smith · July 31, 2020, 05:26:51 PM

Quote from: repetedj on July 31, 2020, 04:09:53 PM
Fred,

Are you now using a pedal to turn the page?
Again, I'm not sure of this.
If the pedal is a midi pedal, would you be able to press the pedal at the time you want the page turned so that the pedal sends the page command into the KB while recording and the command gets recorded. The pedal would be linked to your KB instead of the IPAD.

You would have to know (or configure the pedal) the command the pedal sends. Then you might be able to have the software on the IPAD recognize that command to turn the page.

Once again, I'm not sure about this as I do not have the same setup you do.

As I said in the first post, I use a midi file to turn the page. From the answers I received, this is the source of my problem. You can't both record a midi, and transmit midi data at the same time.

So I live with it. I'm not willing to change my page turn method, as it's too convenient for me.

Cheers,
Fred