Genos freezes when searching for 3rd party styles on USB

[Pianoman]

My Genos freezes for several minutes when I select the styles button when I want to
open a 3rd party style on my main USB underneath the keyboard.

It eventually opens up after a few minutes but then freezes again if I were to press copy
or save.

This only happens with 3rd party styles, or a modified style, many of which I normally use
in performing.
An example would be the Genos style for "Superstition " where I modified the drums because
I didn't like the the original drums. It takes ages to open up the style.

It is a bit of a dilemma for me because I want to travel to a recording session in
another country just carrying a USB stick, and where a Genos will be provided for me.

I am now also using the version 2 superior pack in.my repertoire, so if I use my USB on a
version  1.41 studio Genos my 3rd party styles will open easily  but I won't be able to use the new
Superior pack.

I have formatted my USB stick correctly on Genos and everything worked perfectly until
I upgraded to version 2.

I have the exact same amount of styles (450) in the USB folder as I have in the User section folder ,
which opens without hesitation.

Keeping in mind that this has never happened before, I am completely mystified why it's
happening now.

Has anybody else experienced this problem?

Best Regards,

Abby.

[overover]

Hi Abby,

possibly the Genos is busy creating / updating the Search Index in the background.

Have you recently copied many style files to the Stick?

It might help to let the Genos "rest" for a while (directly after turning on, with the Stick connected).


Best regards,
Chris

[Pianoman]

Hi Chris.

Thank you for your reply.
Yes, this is a folder i created a few days ago as I transferred all my registrations and styles
from my User section of the Genos to the USB stick.

As I mentioned above, the purpose is to travel to another country, thus saving 700€ in
shipment costs for my Genos and all the customs hassle of travelling with a
keyboard from one country to another.

I have other style folders at contain up to 3 times as many styles and they open with
maybe a couple of seconds hesitation.

This particular folder that I created takes up to 3 minutes to open.

I photographed all my settings before updating to version 2 and once I updated I
put all my settings back to how they were before.

This is a 4GB stick that has never given me trouble before.

Best Regards,

Abby.

[soryt]

I have the same problem , with styles and registrations  in User drive, selecting a style /registration cost almost 40 seconds .
I have mailed Yamaha about this problem after update V2 , i hope the have a solution  , ( did reset and it didnt help)
Trying to put the old v 1.41 back again , but it cant be installed anymore

Soneg 

[travlin-easy]

There may be a couple solutions to this problem, both of which are fairly easy. first and foremost, try copying the folder to the root directory of the keyboard and accessing the files from the root - made a big difference with my S-950.

Option #2 is to use a smaller USB drive - something just large enough to hold the files with enough left over for copying and pasting. The size of the USB drive, especially with the newer keyboards, seems to have some bearing on the access time. I don't know why this happens, but it did with my friend's S975.

Good luck,

Gary

[whataguy]

Experience same thing every so often, I just turned it off and back on and resumed playing. Like life, it's just a little bump in the road. No big thing. Don in MI

[DonM]

I have not experienced this.  I have folders and subfolders with styles, text files, midi files, CDGs and registrations in them and they all pull up instantly.  Using a 32 gig stick. 
I am using the USB port on top, and sometimes the one on the back.  Have not used the one underneath.

[Toril S]

No problems here. I have a 64 GB stick.

[Pianoman]

There may be a couple solutions to this problem, both of which are fairly easy. first and foremost, try copying the folder to the root directory of the keyboard and accessing the files from the root - made a big difference with my S-950.

Option #2 is to use a smaller USB drive - something just large enough to hold the files with enough left over for copying and pasting. The size of the USB drive, especially with the newer keyboards, seems to have some bearing on the access time. I don't know why this happens, but it did with my friend's S975.

Good luck,

Gary

Hi Gary,

Good to hear from you.

I just got back from the Computer store where I bought a new USB drive.
It is a 4GB Kingston drive that I think is approved by Yamaha.

My present drive is 4 GB, and it's the smallest capacity that I need for my Files.
They don't sell 2 GB drives anymore here, and 1 GB would be too small.

I think that I should maybe first try your option #1.

My styles folder IS in the root directory of the drive, but I'm thinking of putting
the styles themselves in the root directory, minus the folder.

It will of course mean that I'll have to save the styles directly to the root directory
and then save each single registration per style as I go along.

I just need the drive to work for a couple of weeks, to travel to Germany to
record.

So I'm going to format my new drive in the Gemos and  just load the 60 styles and
registrations that I need for this particular job, right in the root directory, and nothing
else.

They have found a Genos over there from a small outfit  that rents it out to people.
I don't know in what condition it is but it saves me the trouble of taking mine along.

Talking about recording, I was by folks here that it is legal to use Genos styles for
commercial recording. That there are no copyright issues.

Just checking again as I know there some very knowledgeable people here
regarding this question.

I will post my results after I'm. done with transferring the styles and registrations.

My thanks to all for your advice and suggestions.

Best Regards,

Abby.

[soryt]

After having downloaded and installed the V2 again, it is malfunctioning
slow loading of styles and registrations solved!

Soryt 

[Pianoman]

Hi Soryt.

I'm glad that you have managed to solve the problem, sorry about the malfunctioning though.

For my part, I have bought a Yamaha approved USB drive and am in the process of saving
alll my USB styles and registrations directly onto the root directory, without using any folders.

The styles that I've already moved still take a while to open but don't get stuck on "checking "
like they did before.

It is a long and tedious process and I am now at day 2 and am not even halfway through yet.
I just hope that it is a one time thing and that I won't have to reverse the process again.

I formatted the USB drive in the Genos first, just as I always did with other drives that
I've used for my keyboards.

This is a solution that has been proposed by Gary (travlin-easy ) and it seems to have
improved the opening time of styles and registrations.

My  final verdict though, will be when I have completed the correct transfer of all
the remaining styles and registrations, as those that remain in the styles folder still
make the keyboard freeze for a couple of minutes when selecting them for saving to
the root directory of the USB drive.


Thank you Gary.

Best Regards,

Abby.

[overover]

... For my part, I have bought a Yamaha approved USB drive and am in the process of saving
alll my USB styles and registrations directly onto the root directory, without using any folders. ...

Hi Abby,

please be careful: In my opinion this is NOT a good solution! I would NEVER save a larger number of files directly in the ROOT directory of the USB flash drive!

If everything is alright with the Genos, the update has been correctly installed and a suitable USB stick is used, it must make no difference in the loading time, whether a file is stored directly in the ROOT or in a FOLDER. The folder structure should of course not be too "nested". It is ideal to use at most one subfolder level in the main folders (which are located directly in the ROOT).

Compared to previous models, where a folder could contain a maximum of 500 files and subfolders, this number was increased in the Genos to a maximum of 2500.

But beware: In the ROOT directory it can already cause problems with much fewer files! It is NOT recommended for ANY operating system, to store MANY files directly in the ROOT of drives without using folders.

It may be due to certain (defective / corrupt) user files on the USB stick that the file selection reacts so slowly.

In any case, the Genos must be given enough time to create / update the internal Search Index for a specific USB stick. This can take a relatively long time for a particular Stick, if it contains a very large number of files. In NO case, however, I would advise you to save a lot of files directly in the ROOT of a stick!


Best regards,
Chris

[Pianoman]

Hi Chris.

Thanks for the warning.
I will stop at once, even though I just wanted to put 450 styles and their associated
registrations to the root directory.

It was to have been for just 2 weeks in a recording studio where I didn't want any slow
loading or freezing while recording.

The recording gig consists of chaining up to 60 songs like a live gig, jumping from
1 song to the next (with canned applause between songs) for a total of 3 hours of music.

That's why it's essential that there be no slow loading or freezing of the keyboard.

My install of the version 2 upgrade went without a hitch, but I think I'll do it again and
see if that will solve the problem.

This problem only applies to the USB drive. The User section works perfectly but I won't be
travelling with my Genos. There will be another Genos provided for me at my destination.

Thanks again for the warning. I was desperate because my time window is closing.

Best Regards,

Abby.

[DonM]

Abby, I agree with Chris, the fact that you are using folders should make no difference at all in the speed.
I'm reading all text, midi files, CDGs, Registrations and a number of styles from USB and it is all loaded instantly.
Each category is in its own folder, and some styles are several folders deep.
What Gary said was probably true on some older models, but I never experienced that on any of them. 
I think you either have a corrupt style somewhere, or your Genos is malfunctioning. 
I will talk to Gary on the phone tomorrow and maybe we can put our heads together to think of something else.

[Pianoman]

Hello Don.

Thank you for your prompt reply.

As I mentioned above, my intention was to save 450 styles and their associated registrations
to the root directory of a USB drive dedicated just for these styles and nothing else.

That was partially incorrect. 450 are ALL the styles that I have in my usual gig
folder.

What I intended to do was to load some 60 styles and 50 registration banks on to the.
root directory just for a 2 week stint.
That is the entire amount of styles and registrations that I need for this particular project.

Do you think that this could be harmful to the keyboard?

I have now stopped loading any more styles to the root directory until other solutions
can be found.

I am considering reinstalling the version 2 upgrade again, to see if that will help.
I'll first have to take snapshots of all the effects and system settings that I have made
since upgrading.

Waiting to hear your first recordings on your new Genos.

Best Regards,

Abby.

[soryt]

I downloaded the V2 software again and after installing it my EQ, Midi and other settings are not changed.
I hope it wil work fore you

Soryt 

[EileenL]

I have never had any problems with my Genos. I use a Fast reading 64 Gb USB stick and have an exact copy of my user drive on it so if I use another Genos everything is there that I require. I use the underside USB port when using my own keyboard but when using another Genos use the front port.
All works as it should. I even updated my keyboard with the stick in and still all fine.

[Fred Smith]

Trying to put the old v 1.41 back again , but it cant be installed anymore

I had no problem reinstalling 1.41, so it can be done.

Cheers,
Fred

[soryt]

Thats strange , i tried it several times and it didnt load ?

Soryt 

[EileenL]

Yes you can reinstall it but why would you want to.

[Fred Smith]

Yes you can reinstall it but why would you want to.

To get decent size fonts in text files.

Cheers,
Fred

[soryt]

I have never had any problems with my Genos. I use a Fast reading 64 Gb USB stick and have an exact copy of my user drive on it so if I use another Genos everything is there that I require. I use the underside USB port when using my own keyboard but when using another Genos use the front port.
All works as it should. I even updated my keyboard with the stick in and still all fine.

Than you have a lot of luck  , I have loading times of 40/60seconds since the Update from my user drive , and several freeze ups
I have done a new download of the V2 and re installed it  , its a little better but not as good as before the update .
And i am waiting for a reply  of Yamaha EU if they know a solution of this "problem"

Soryt 

[DonM]

Hello Don.

Thank you for your prompt reply.

As I mentioned above, my intention was to save 450 styles and their associated registrations
to the root directory of a USB drive dedicated just for these styles and nothing else.

That was partially incorrect. 450 are ALL the styles that I have in my usual gig
folder.

What I intended to do was to load some 60 styles and 50 registration banks on to the.
root directory just for a 2 week stint.
That is the entire amount of styles and registrations that I need for this particular project.

Do you think that this could be harmful to the keyboard?

I have now stopped loading any more styles to the root directory until other solutions
can be found.

I am considering reinstalling the version 2 upgrade again, to see if that will help.
I'll first have to take snapshots of all the effects and system settings that I have made
since upgrading.

Waiting to hear your first recordings on your new Genos.

Best Regards,

Abby.

There should be no problem with doing that.  Not sure why you are having this problem.
I do not think reinstalling the older OS will help.
I will do some recording on the job this weekend.  I did one at home last night but am not happy with the vocal sound.  I may use the external processor (T.C. Helicon Harmony M) on the job until I can tweak the onboard vocal sound some more. 

[EileenL]

I am not lucky at all Soyrt and there are lots of us who have not had any trouble at all. I use lots of third party styles and make sure I only keep the ones that work well on my keyboard. Have done every up grade and also never had a problem. Use good quality USB sticks always formatted on the keyboard. I have one in the underside compartment which is 64Gb and one I use for transferring content from my computer. Very rarely use the back USB slot as I don't need to. My styles always load as they should and it is only the Audio styles that need that little extra time to load but that is normal.

[EileenL]

Hi Abby,
Since the styles of the Superior pack are in the Expansion part of the keyboard and you have to press  expansion to access them did you then save them one by one to the user section or USB.

[Fred Smith]

Than you have a lot of luck  , I have loading times of 40/60seconds since the Update from my user drive , and several freeze ups
I have done a new download of the V2 and re installed it  , its a little better but not as good as before the update .
And i am waiting for a reply  of Yamaha EU if they know a solution of this "problem"

Soryt,

It sounds to me like your search indexing has not been updated, or is not working.

When I search, I get a message at the bottom which says "updating search information" or "search information updated n minutes ago".

If you see the "updating" message on a search, then leave the keyboard alone for a while. Make sure all power saving features are disabled. It should take no more than 20 minutes to update the index. Then your searches will be a lot speedier.

I would try this first with no USB stick to test the User drive searches. Once that works, do it again with a USB stick inserted.

Cheers,
Fred

[Toril S]

Maybe the CPU? Hope you get it sorted out soon!

[travlin-easy]

Spent some time talking with Don Mason this afternoon, and both of have come to the conclusion that Abby more than likely has a corrupt style file in his collection that is causing the problem. Though they are rare, indeed, they can occur and when they do, usually, the only fix is to go them one at a time, which is a painful process, until the problem repeats itself.

Though I have never encountered a complete lockup with any of my arranger keyboards, I have encountered style files and MIDI files that produced error messages, and my only solution, regardless of pushing the OK button, was a quick reset, which is the kiss of death during a live performance. The last thing I ever wished to happen during performance was extended dead time. Fortunately, I always had a work around and could instantly select an MP3 Karaoke video from my laptop and keep the show going while I rebooted the arranger keyboard. The second it rebooted, I would get on the keys and play along with the MP3 file, thus no one was the wiser, but it scared the Hell out of ME!

Gary

[overover]

Spent some time talking with Don Mason this afternoon, and both of have come to the conclusion that Abby more than likely has a corrupt style file in his collection that is causing the problem. Though they are rare, indeed, they can occur and when they do, usually, the only fix is to go them one at a time, which is a painful process, until the problem repeats itself. ...

I recommend to use the PC (Windows) program "PSR Style Database":

http://www.wierzba.homepage.t-online.de/psd/psdmain.htm

This program can list huge amounts of Styles in a relatively short time. The Styles to be listed / analyzed can be stored on a USB-Stick, on the PC's hard disk or in the User drive of the Genos (if connected in USB Storage Mode to the PC). Up to 20 columns with all needed information about the Styles can be configured by the user. The red-bordered fields in this image clearly indicate a corrupt Style file:




By the way: This program can also used to list MIDI files: After installing you will find TWO new shortcuts on the Windows desktop (to start the program either in Style mode or in MIDI file mode).


Best regards,
Chris

[Pianoman]

There is a tendency by some people of saying " there is no problem with mine " in many different
posts over the years after  people who have encountered a problem in their keyboard appeal for
suggestions, explanations or solutions.

In a way, I think that it's an attempt to protect Yamaha's reputation at all costs,  but also
adds insult to injury for those who are struggling with a problem.
It is not helpful.

It's like buying an identical gas heater as one's neighbour, then when seeing the neighbor's
house gp up in flames because of the heater, standing outside on the lawn and saying
" my heater has no problems".

I must reiterate again that this is not a helpful attitude.
It would better to not comment at all.

Best Regards,

Abby.