MIDI files while gigging, is that a big NO NO, or do you occasionally use them?

[Toril S]

Hello musical friends!
I use MIDI files to learn songs. Some of the files even have lyrics, and I can see the chords on my T5 screen. I don't read sheet music, so this is a great way for me to learn songs. Much easier than listening to songs on Spotify.

I am an amateur musician who gig occasionally. Although I am no great musician, I have never used MIDI files when performing, except for one, that I use when we all, me included, get up to exercise (usually great fun!) Sometimes I get request for songs that I don't know how to play well. Lets say I have the MIDI file of that song on my USB stick. Is it then OK to "fake it" for the sake of keeping the party spirits, or is this a big NO NO? What do you do? It is also much easier (at least for mow) to sing to a backing track than to play and sing simultaneously. I look forward to reading your opinions on this.

[Al Ram]

Toril

My opinion . . .

First, i never use midis, mostly because i do not have a use for them, do not need them do not want them.

I think it is OK to use midis. I have strong reservations about the faking part. . . . . like faking to play the song in the keyboard while the midi is actually playing . . . . I would NOT do that. NEVER.     However, if i would need to use a midi as a backing track for singing that is OK but without the fake playing just the singing.  That way no-one can complain about 'fraud'.

When a song is requested that i do not know . . . i just say that i do not have it right now but will try to get it for the next time . .. . .  or . . . . .  i look up the chords and lyrics on the internet and quickly find a suitable style for it on the fly . . . .  however, this last part is only when i am with friends . . .  i would never sing a song in public if i did not rehearse it first.   Usually it takes me a while to learn a new song, rehearse it, find the suitable style, create a registration, etc.    So, i never do this on the fly.

As a side comment, the opposite from you . . . . for me it's much easier to sing while playing than to sing to a backing track.  When I sing and play myself, i feel i am in control . . . . with the backing track, i have no control and most memorize the song to the letter and to the music. 

I believe honesty and looking and acting professional will give a performer credibility.

I would like to clarify that I respect everyone . . . . . midis or no midis . . . this is just the way I do it but do not discount the efforts of others.   

Thanks

[Toril S]

Thanks a lot Al! I actually found out now that you are right that playing the song  yourself gives you more  Control. You know when the chords change!  It was not easy to sync myself to the MIDI! I just have to rehearse a lot. As for the play faking part, I thought I could play along with the MIDI, but it does not work well. I saw a video of a guy who sang to a backing track on his keyboard. But he actually stood beside his keyboard.

[Bruce Breen]

I don't use them when I play gigs...
Although, I have some in case the venue wants some music playing while I am on a break.

And I made some for my wife's favourite songs - in case she is with me at the gig and we want to dance...
(Colour My World by Chicago is one)

[Fred Smith]

Toril,

Yes it's ok to use midi files, especially in your example circumstance.

Your job is to entertain. Your audience doesn't care how.

Let your audience decide what you use, not the purists.

Cheers,
Fred

[Toril S]

Bruce and Fred: Thanks a lot!

[Robert van Weersch]

I've used MIDI files for gigs where some very specific songs (mostly medleys) were requested in advance and I could not recreate them using styles and registrations. So I created custom MIDIs, created by copy/pasting from several files and creating transition bars between them. But in all other occasions, I / we don't use MIDI files.

[Toril S]

Thanks Robert😀

[PierreSW]

Hey!
Midi files are perfect to work with.
1 You can change the key to suit your song and see the lyrics.
2 Lower the volume to 0 on the melody track and play it yourself.
3 You can play more instruments besides keyboards, for example
    accordion, guitar and saxophone to a midi file.
In my case, I play guitar, pedal steel guitar and sing, and it wouldn't work without midi files.

And I use Styles too.

Greetings Pierre

[beykock]

Hi Toril :

It is much better and wiser to use midi files than playing and singing whilst you are making mistakes.
Mistakes make you nervous ...

In fact you are NEVER faking ... your " singing " is " live "
right ?

The audience does not care at all as long as your " act " is OK and people are having fun and enjoying your performance.

Finally, you are an entertainer, right ?

As I said before many giggers are using midi files from time to time. Very usual and normal. No problem at all and nobody cares.

Have fun and no stress !

Babette

[torben]

Hi Toril

in my honest opinion midifiles are great for rehearsing a song. But using them secretly and fully to fake that it is you who are playing, is - I am sorry to say - in my view (with one exception, see below) a total scam, fraud etc ...

As simple as that. There are no excuses ...

One exception though. Styles are a sort of midifiles and so are pre installed intros, breaks and endings. But we cannot live without them ...

kind regards

Torben

[beykock]

 Musicians (  e.g. a bass player, a guitar player, a drummer etc. ) might all say the arranger keyboard is faking all instruments.

Babette

[torben]

Babette - a strange observation ... every instrument has its own sounds... a work arranger has many ...

Bottomline is that a keyboardplayer, sitting at his/her KB pretending to play whilst a midi file is playing in stead, can hardly be seen as anything other than a cheat ...

regards

Torben

[beykock]

Some giggers ( OMB ) are playing other instruments than just their arranger during their performance.

Whilst they are playing their trumpet, their guitar or whatever their arranger keyboard will become a midi file player.

They do not need to explain their audience anything and the audience does not care at all.

As long as the audience is pleased there are no rules, IMHO.

A singer is also a musician.
There is no reason why a keyboard player/singer cannot use a midi file when needed. Nobody is perfect.

Midi files are made for that particular job.

No business like show business.

Best wishes, Babette

[Toril S]

Thanks Pierre, Babette and Torben. I believe there is a big difference in how you use the MIDI files. If I am playing my accordion to a MIDI backing track noone would look at me as a fraud. But to let your hands hover over the keys, play the MIDI and sell it off as  your own  performance is another matter. Maybe the best way is to be completely open about it. Say something like: I can play a recording of this song for you. My concern is that this might mislead my audience to believe that this is how I make my music! I often play for several hours, and I would hate to give the impression that I am just sitting there spewing out pretecorded stuff. Not easy this!

[Janus]

Some giggers ( OMB ) are playing other instruments than just their arranger during their performance.

Whilst they are playing their trumpet, their guitar or whatever their arranger keyboard will become a midi file player.

They do not need to explain their audience anything and the audience does not care at all.

As long as the audience is pleased there are no rules, IMHO.

A singer is also a musician.
There is no reason why a keyboard player/singer cannot use a midi file when needed. Nobody is perfect.

Midi files are made for that particular job.

No business like show business.

Best wishes, Babette

There is no different between a midi file or a stylel
They are both not made bij the keyboard player
In fact you play only one channel the rest is played by the keyboard

[Toril S]

To silence the melody line in a MIDI and play it yourself must be OK. In that case it functions almost like a DJ style.

[Janus]

To silence the melody line in a MIDI and play it yourself must be OK. In that case it functions almost like a DJ style.

It is better to play with the left hand the bass or the chords and right the melodie
or in piano style the whole keyboard
Then you can play free with both hands

[MarkF_48]

The 'styles' an arranger uses are a collection of MIDI files that the player controls via the keys and buttons on the instrument, so in a sense you already do use MIDI files, just not in the way of a complete backing track. I think if a MIDI backing track is used sparingly to add a bit more fullness to a performance and it isn't obvious in a mix, it's perfectly OK. Even better is to use a MIDI backing you have created yourself rather than one you simply found somewhere.

[robinez]

The 'styles' an arranger uses are a collection of MIDI files that the player controls via the keys and buttons on the instrument, so in a sense you already do use MIDI files, just not in the way of a complete backing track. I think if a MIDI backing track is used sparingly to add a bit more fullness to a performance and it isn't obvious in a mix, it's perfectly OK. Even better is to use a MIDI backing you have created yourself rather than one you simply found somewhere.

i totally agree,

In my opinion there is not much difference between using a style or using a midi file. The only thing that is different is that you can proof that you are able to play the chord in the correct timing of the arrangement when using styles (and indeed a style is also a small part of a midi file playing that style variation). When using midi files this chords selection and arrangement is done for you by the midi file, but then you have two hands free to play anything you want on top of that midi file. Both methods are fine in my opinion.

You can even combine a style and midi file during your performance, the genos can do this perfectly and the chord structure of the midi file plays the style. It works really good.

[beykock]

Hi Mark :

I think you made a good point here.

Indeed, it might be a very useful suggestion.
" Make your own midi files ". 🍀

I think the audience will appreciate that very much and understand much better.

Simply call it " Backing Track, made by myself ".

I like it. Thank you !

Babette

[Janus]

Hi Mark :

I think you made a good point here.

Indeed, it might be a very useful suggestion.
" Make your own midi files ". 🍀

I think the audience will appreciate that very much and understand much better.

Simply call it " Backing Track, made by myself ".

Yes make your own tracks
don't use the style intro's en endings
Keep it simple
most i only use the drums from the style more like a metronoom
Dont use compleet midi files
When you use pro midifiles everybody use the same files
The public notice that they are all the same by different players



I like it. Thank you !

Babette

[Toril S]

Thanks Janus, MarkF and Robinez. I make MIDIS of all my recorded songs, so here I am in luck. They do not sound as good as pro ones, but no one can say that other players used them too. But in that case I might as well play the songs the traditional way😀

[RoyceM]

At the majority of my gigs, I walk around afterwards and greet folks and do a lot of hand shaking. During this phase, I let play mp3 or midi files as background music, which is always relevant to them...and they love it. (I call this bringing things to a soft landing.)

When I first started gigging, an activity director told me a guy had come and let some kind of "automated" music play on his keyboard. She felt like she was paying him to, in essence, just play a radio. I suspect the fella probably had done a lot of multi-track recording work and was misunderstood.

Whatever we do, I'm in favor of being honest and clear about it. I entertain with my playing, song and artist trivia, corny humor, interaction with audiences, bad poetry (Burma-shave slogans), and special recordings that are understood to be recordings...and I DON'T sing (the nicest thing I do for audiences). I am not showy, just folksy. Many places repeatedly emphasize that I am their favorite, which often gets reflected in the voluntary higher rates they pay me.

- Royce

[Toril S]

Hello Royce! Thank you for this very useful insight into how you do your gigs! You made me really wish I was there to attend one of them, sounds a lot of fun. I also read poems and essays, mostly things I have written myself, and I don't sing, I will try to train my voice for some occasional singing, but we will see how that goes Until now I have not used MIDI files, but you gave me an idea with the hand shaking and background music

[mikf]

I don't think you can have absolute rules about how you entertain. The only real question is - did it work, were people entertained ? Many people entertain very successfully by singing over backing tracks, I dont think it matters what the process is, midi on a keyboard, or MP3s on a PA system. The only measures that matter are - did you present it well, did it sound good, did people like it.  But there are some obvious guidelines. For example, if you go in to a venue as a solo keyboard player, then spend a lot of the time pretending to play over midis, I doubt people would appreciate that. On the other hand, if you go in as a solo player, play everything live, but badly, I doubt you will be back either.
Mike

[travlin-easy]

Plus 1, Mike.

Gary

[Toril S]

Good point Mike. There is one senior club where I have played for 20 years, so I must be doing at least something right. But I can always be better. A lot of good advice here! Things to consuder. Thanks everyone!

[rene1242]

Thisis very intresting topic  I agree that a performer must not use midis in any way while playing live in fact when someone uses a midi file he is simply laughing at himself , playing midi is not fun infact its boring-- unfortunately I see some people playing midi files its their busniss but I dont like it . Thats why every cover I do I simply go in a big process to create a style for the song I`m doing no 1 - it will sound unique like no one else cause I made it no2 creating styles is frustrating but fun at the end of the day it give you satisfaction that you achieved something good- From here I wish you a happy merry xmas !!!! Cheers Rene (SynthGrooves)

[Janus]

Thisis very intresting topic  I agree that a performer must not use midis in any way while playing live in fact when someone uses a midi file he is simply laughing at himself , playing midi is not fun infact its boring-- unfortunately I see some people playing midi files its their busniss but I dont like it . Thats why every cover I do I simply go in a big process to create a style for the song I`m doing no 1 - it will sound unique like no one else cause I made it no2 creating styles is frustrating but fun at the end of the day it give you satisfaction that you achieved something good- From here I wish you a happy merry xmas !!!! Cheers Rene (SynthGrooves)

If you want play all yourself don't use a keyboard

The keyboard plays 90 % of the song
Styles are made of midi files cut in pieces
When you play the pieces are made to a song
What is the use off that ?
Only a pianist in front off a public plays life
Better start from scratch
Start with only the drums more like a metronoom to keep track
Record all other tracks one by one