Changing and saving Left voices in registrations

JanCK · January 12, 2019, 02:43:25 PM

Newbie here, so pardon if this is an obvious answer.

I'm making one registration bank per song. I save the style and tempo in Reg #1 button along with a split full keyboard, because I usually start my songs with that voice. I split this voice because this seems to be what is needed to get other Left voices in the next buttons. Then in Reg #2 button, I want to switch to a sax in Rt 1., with, say, an organ in Left voice. Then, in Reg #3, I want a guitar in Rt 1., with electric piano in Left voice. I save, save, save along the way to both memory buttons and memory bank with the song title. Problem is, it won't save anything in the Left voice except whatever is in Reg. #1. Why is this? And how can I achieve variety in Left voice settings?

I remember reading somewhere on the forum that Left voice is tied to "style" in some way??? I don't know, maybe that is an erroneous memory caused by a dazed and muddled mind during one of the countless wee small hours reading this forum!

Wim NL · January 12, 2019, 03:19:02 PM

Left voices are saved with the style

JanCK · January 12, 2019, 03:21:56 PM

Thanks Wim NL. Then do you or anyone else know if is there a "work-around" on that?

Wim NL · January 12, 2019, 03:29:00 PM

You have to save the style also in a registration

JanCK · January 12, 2019, 03:33:01 PM

Yes, I save the style is in Reg. #1. But then, does this make it impossible to then save different LH voices in the other registration buttons? That's what I understood from your previous reply.

Wim NL · January 12, 2019, 03:48:15 PM

You can make other left voices selections.
But when you want to save these left voices with the right voices.
You have to tick also voice as style to save a Registration.

JanCK · January 12, 2019, 04:00:01 PM

Here's what I'm trying to accomplish: I want to keep the style and tempo throughout the whole song, but I want to change voices in Reg #2-10. I don't want those voices to be tied to any particular accompaniment variation, which is why I don't check style and tempo in the reg. memory box. When I keep style and tempo checked in #2-10, then whatever variation is lit at the time is what is played. But, again, I don't want voices to be tied to any particular variation. Hope this makes sense.

Fred Smith · January 12, 2019, 04:05:39 PM

Quote from: JanCK on January 12, 2019, 04:00:01 PM
Here's what I'm trying to accomplish: I want to keep the style and tempo throughout the whole song, but I want to change voices in Reg #2-10. I don't want those voices to be tied to any particular accompaniment variation, which is why I don't check style and tempo in the reg. memory box. When I keep style and tempo checked in #2-10, then whatever variation is lit at the time is what is played. But, again, I don't want voices to be tied to any particular variation. Hope this makes sense.

Yes, it makes sense, but it can't be done, without tricking the instrument.

The left voice is part of the Style group. To change the left voice in a registration, you must include the Style group when you memorize, and doing so also memorizes the variation.

To do what you want you need to use the "missing style trick", as follows:
1. Copy a style anywhere you want.
2. Memorize this style, and your left voice, in a registration.
3. Now delete the style.

When you load the registration, it will load your left voice, then go looking for the style to load. When it can't find it, it leaves the currently loaded style alone.

Cheers,
Fred

JanCK · January 12, 2019, 04:17:42 PM

Thanks very much, Fred...I will try this.

Wim NL · January 12, 2019, 04:29:35 PM

You can also use the OTS settings.
Or use a multipad for the left.

JanCK · January 12, 2019, 04:33:33 PM

Wow! Fred's solution worked! One weeks-long frustration solved...only 60+ more to go, and I'll be ready to gig again!

Wim NL -- My attempts with OTS and MultiPads have not gone well, though they're on the list for further work.

Thanks, Jana

Fred Smith · January 12, 2019, 04:48:23 PM

Quote from: JanCK on January 12, 2019, 04:33:33 PM
Wow! Fred's solution worked!

Don't sound so surprised, Jana.

Cheers,
Fred

JanCK · January 12, 2019, 04:54:25 PM

Well, Fred, I'm not surprised that your answer worked, only that I actually got it to work. I have no prior arranger keyboard experience, and am not so great at
computer-related activities. Maybe the Genos will change that self-opinion in time. One can only hope!

stephenm52 · January 13, 2019, 07:21:06 AM

Maybe I'm confused and may be missing something but here's my work around to accomplish what JanCK is trying to. First I don't have my Genos with me while away from home, but I do have an s970 with me. With that said I've set up a registration, I left the OTS link to the off position. I use reg 1 for style assignment/tempo, then use registrations 2 thru to 8 ( no 9 and 10 on the s970) change voices. When I want to change variation I simply tap the A, B, C or D buttons. Seems that's a possible solution either that or I'm missing something.

JanCK · January 13, 2019, 11:17:44 AM

Fred's solution works for me as long as I'm tapping the registration buttons in ascending order. If I go back go a lower registration number, it keeps the previous Left voice that I was just using, rather than the one that I had set for the currently pressed lower number.

As an example: I've used Reg # 1, 2, 3, 4, each with a different Left voices. So, now I'm using #4, and want to go back to #3. When I tap #3, it keeps whatever Left voice was in #4 rather than what was saved in #3.

It's still better than it was, and maybe I'm just asking for too much freedom. Maybe the work around is just to repeat registration in the upper buttons that aren't otherwise being used.

Fred Smith · January 13, 2019, 11:49:15 AM

Quote from: JanCK on January 13, 2019, 11:17:44 AM
Fred's solution works for me as long as I'm tapping the registration buttons in ascending order. If I go back go a lower registration number, it keeps the previous Left voice that I was just using, rather than the one that I had set for the currently pressed lower number.

As an example: I've used Reg # 1, 2, 3, 4, each with a different Left voices. So, now I'm using #4, and want to go back to #3. When I tap #3, it keeps whatever Left voice was in #4 rather than what was saved in #3.

It's still better than it was, and maybe I'm just asking for too much freedom. Maybe the work around is just to repeat registration in the upper buttons that aren't otherwise being used.

This shouldn't be happening. Post your registration here, and let us take a look at it.

Cheers,
Fred

Fred Smith · January 13, 2019, 11:51:08 AM

Quote from: stephenm52 on January 13, 2019, 07:21:06 AM
Maybe I'm confused and may be missing something but here's my work around to accomplish what JanCK is trying to. First I don't have my Genos with me while away from home, but I do have an s970 with me. With that said I've set up a registration, I left the OTS link to the off position. I use reg 1 for style assignment/tempo, then use registrations 2 thru to 8 ( no 9 and 10 on the s970) change voices. When I want to change variation I simply tap the A, B, C or D buttons. Seems that's a possible solution either that or I'm missing something.

Your system works for right voices, but not for the left voice.

But I have a question in return. Why use both OTS and registration? Why not just use one or the other?

Cheers,
Fred

stephenm52 · January 13, 2019, 11:59:48 AM

Quote from: Fred Smith on January 13, 2019, 11:51:08 AM
Your system works for right voices, but not for the left voice.

But I have a question in return. Why use both OTS and registration? Why not just use one or the other?

Cheers,
Fred

What I found is the left voice does change, however I have not tried raising the left voice by an octave. I believe that's what JanCK was trying to do too. From her post I was under the assumption she did not want to change variations of styles via the registrations, but I could have very well Mis-interpreted the question.

You also pose a good question. I use registrations to change variations when I work my own keyboards, I was just giving an alternative.

jwyvern · January 13, 2019, 01:30:37 PM

Quote from: JanCK on January 12, 2019, 04:00:01 PM
Here's what I'm trying to accomplish: I want to keep the style and tempo throughout the whole song, but I want to change voices in Reg #2-10. I don't want those voices to be tied to any particular accompaniment variation, which is why I don't check style and tempo in the reg. memory box. When I keep style and tempo checked in #2-10, then whatever variation is lit at the time is what is played. But, again, I don't want voices to be tied to any particular variation. Hope this makes sense.

Jan- At the risk of sticking my neck out

Ensure OTS link (next to the ACMP button) is off.
Save the voices (left and right) and the style you want set to your initial variation in reg1 making sure when memorising there are ticks in at least style and voice (and you may want others eg. tempo).
Now change L and R voices to the combinations you want and memorise them to successive registrations using the SAME ticks (although tempo can be omitted if you do not need to force changes, either way it's not critical in this case). You also have the option to set a different style variation before memorising and if you did it would not cause the voices to change.
Or if you prefer you could leave the Variation as it was in reg1 and change it manually while playing. If you do you won't disturb the voices because you set the OTS link to off and saved it off with the tick in style.
Don't forget to save the bank when done.

As far as I can see the above standard procedure should allow you to do most of what you describe maybe with some extra thought given on choice of variations to ensure they merge well when selected, with variations you may be setting during playing.

John

tyrosaurus · January 13, 2019, 02:54:42 PM

Unless Genos registrations work differently to Tyros/PSR ones (and there are obviously some differences), the 'Missing Style Trick' as described by Fred should work if correctly applied, and should allow you to switch voices (Left and Right) to what was memorised in each registration button without affecting the currently playing style or variation.

This should apply when selecting registrations in any order, although obviously anytime that you select button #1, the style variation will switch to whatever variation was selected when you memorised into that button!

If it is not working for you, then either Genos behaves differently in this respect to Tyros/PSR models (which I can't check since I don't have Genos), or you have not memorised the registrations correctly.

It is a useful trick, so it would be interesting to know if it does work on Genos.

Regards

Ian

JanCK · January 13, 2019, 04:36:43 PM

Fred's trick is now working in both ascending and descending button pushes. I think I made a mistake on one of the registrations I was experimenting with yesterday, which caused it to only work when ascending. Now it's working on one of my songs just fine, so the problem was operator error.
Thanks to all.
Jana