How to find the melody?

[DerekA]

Fingered On Bass works really well for me. I have always been able to get the chord I wanted. I have never really had good results with AI fingered, but maybe that's just me.

I find it really satisfying to play slashed chords, 9ths, sus2, sus4 etc - they can make a real difference to the overall 'flavour'

I learned to play (many) years ago with the "pointer system" which included learning inversions, which maybe helps me to finger these chords.

[Ron]

Let us not forget that for the complete beginner, Yamaha gives the option of Single Finger chords.  Good enough to get you started in making music which is what it is all about.  Then you can undertake understanding chords.

Ron

[KurtAgain]

In my opinion, there is a common misconception about AI Fingered.

AI Fingered is not about being able to play complicated chords in a slightly less complicated way. It's about being able to control the bass in an easier way than with Fingered On Bass.

Of course, this is not for complete beginners. But it can make the difference between whether the automatic accompaniment sounds boring or good.

[mikf]

Bogdan
There is nothing exotic about the chords Andy mentions. Every appropriate chord is just a collection of 3 or 4 notes that sounds good in the song harmony.
As I pointed out earlier in the thread, these chord names are not complicated. The naming system identifies the notes that need to be played, in a very simple way.
Of course, everyone has to step their way, beginners will initially ignore these chords. But they should not think that once they know two basic chords - major and minor - they can stop there. Extended and altered chords, inversions and chord voicing, are all important in getting music to sound great. Over time, they should learn about these things. As they should also learn how and when to add harmony notes in the rh.
I frequently see on this forum how people will go to great lengths to get a guitar voice to sound exactly like Hank Marvin, or a  clarinet to sound like Aker Bilk, yet not be willing to learn how to play Dmin7b5. Somehow they think this is complicated music theory. But it's not, it's just about getting music to sound better.
But there is no escaping that some of these chords, while relatively easy to play on a piano, using two hands, are hard to play on an arranger where the lh alone has to drive it. The AI system gives you a way to do this without tying your fingers in a knot.
Mike

[BogdanH]

hi Mike,
I have a great respect for your (and Andy's) knowledge and playing skill. But you forgot how it is being a beginner/hobby musician. My impression is, that even most of us here (including myself) are playing keyboard for several years, we are still beginners.. and will most probably remain beginners.

Of course we wish to be better players. But without having a real teacher, we can only get so far. Yes, over the time we learn some new chord, usually by coincidence when we learn some new song -that is, on the need basis. What I'm saying is, why would I bother with learning i.e. diminished chords, if I don't need them in songs that I play? However, one day I might stumble on a song that requires it and then I will just play it -maybe not even knowing it's called diminished (or until keyboard tells me what chord that is).
It's opposite if we have a teacher. In this case teacher would say "today you will start learning this song and by doing that, you will also learn new chord type, called diminished".

Yes, for us hobby players, every chord is "exotic" until we don't need it for the song that we wish to play -and I quite like that way of learning 

Bogdan

[mikf]

Bogdan
I think you have an impression that those of us who had classical training were walked through things like fancy chords and their use by our piano teacher - and nothing could be further from the truth. My piano teacher taught me to play scales, arpeggios, read music, all only classical and never mentioned such a thing as a chord.
Mike

[BogdanH]

That's interesting, Mike.. but yes, I can imagine that for piano playing (especially classical music) learning approach is specific. When I was playing accordion as a kid (folk music mostly), the first thing that teacher taught me, was C-F-G major 

Greetings,
Bogdan

[pjd]

AI Fingered is not about being able to play complicated chords in a slightly less complicated way. It's about being able to control the bass in an easier way than with Fingered On Bass.

The AI system gives you a way to do this without tying your fingers in a knot.

Some of Yamaha's digital pianos provide rhythm+bass (P series) and auto-accompaniment (CSP series). The default chord recognition mode is what we know as "AI Full Keyboard". Yamaha never come out and say this explicitly, but reading between the lines, this is the default mode. CSP offers Fingered (with a split point) as an option.

This is sensible. Playing all of those tight note clusters in the left hand on piano is exactly what piano teachers tell you NOT to do.

All the best -- pj

[andyg]

Playing all of those tight note clusters in the left hand on piano is exactly what piano teachers tell you NOT to do.

I recognise that! As I've said before many times, piano teachers are usually very good at what they do. However long experience has shown me that some (thankfully not all!) do not appreciate the differences between piano and arranger keyboard. To them it's just a piano with extra buttons and drums and most of those in that category teach keyboard poorly. I've had to rescue quite a few students, often having to right back to basics for what the left hand does and explaining how to use the instrument. (One never used anything else other than piano and drums, with no keyboard split and all chords played in root position near the bottom of the keyboard!) Happy to say that they all survived, several going on to enjoy great success in their keyboard exams.

FWIW, apart from the very young, and those with a left hand disability, all my students start with fingered chords and standard notation - no 'EZ Play' music allowed.

[mikf]

I started to play by ear when I was only about 9 years old, and I learned all the chords by myself. Sometimes by trial and error, sometimes by looking at sheet music for popular songs. But always it was driven by trying to find the best sounding harmony for the accompaniment. And as you get more competent, you look for better and better chords to improve your playing. That drive to make it sound better should be a constant. On a piano you can't do that thru better speakers, or tweaking voices or styles, you do it thru better playing, better harmony, better arrangement.
Mike