Critique Genos2..by owners?

[Amwilburn]

I've now found 2 downgrades as well: (well technically only 1:)

1) the OLED to LCD screen (already mentioned), loses readability; no true black
2) THe BigBandBrass SW which is an orchestral brass ensemble with solo shake trumpet when at high velocities; in the previous versions, there were separate shake trumpet panned left and right (indeed, the samples even ended at slightly different times), they've now reduced it to 1 single shake trumpet, center panned... because the sound is now in mono (same as it was on the CVP505 and PSRs950)...
*Update* no wait, turns out it's the *insert* effect making it mono; remove it and the sample itself is still in stereo. What the heck?  That seems like a *really* bizarre oversight/choice.

3*) Not a downgrade, but I expected a new Tutti after 20 years. Nope, same one.
They *did* add a couple of new brass tutti's (which sound incredible) but neither has the Timpany/Crash added.


Overall I'm still really impressed with how it sounds overall compared to all other keyboards on the market, but there have been some odd choices too.


If anybody thinks G1 and G2 are the same, you must thing G1 and T5 are the same, and T5 and T4 are the same, going all the way back to T2 (which was clearly a huge difference from T1 to T2). Which subsequently means you think the T2 and the Genos2 are the same; keep in mind TravelinEasy transfers all these files to his s950, which is *below* a T2 (but above a T1, and with the drums of the T4/T5, albeit in mono) in chipset. Yup, one of the biggest differences from T1 to T2 to T3 to T4 was the new drum kits ; T4 to T5 added 2 (specialty percussion kits), then G1 added 10 Revo kits, 20 new kits in total.


The G1 had revolutionary (no pun intended) Revo drums; on the G2, those Revo drums are all in the Legacy folder. The G2 has at least *17 new kits* that I've found, including a *new* Revo kit; and the G1 legacy versions got named 2 or 3 (EDM Kit 2).

By comparison, the T2 added 2 kits to T1, T3 added 3 kits to T2 drums, and T4 added 10, which was part of the huge jump we talk about.

T2 only had 19 kits, 2 of which were SFX
T3 had 22
T4 had 27 + 7 in legacy for 34 total
T5 had 30 + 6 in legacy for 36 total (I believe the 2 extra were Pop Latin 2 and cymbal)
G1 has 47 + 9 in legacy for 56 total (G1 was indeed a huge jump)
G2 has 57 + 17 in legacy (which include the 10 Revo from G1! The Ambi kits and revo kits are completely different samples) for *74 kits in total*!
which means there are *18* new kits, I must've missed one of the new ones.

I did *not* include gospel ad libs, otherwise T4 and newer gets 1 additional kit.

Here are the voice list links for you to checkout yourself, but *anybody* who's played arrangers for a while knows that the *big* jumps are signalled by drum kits. And this is the 2nd biggest jump: like I said, this easily clears the jump from T2 to T3; 2nd only to the jump from T5 to G1 *on paper*.

https://uk.yamaha.com/files/download/other_assets/7/313437/tyros2_en2_b1.pdf
https://usa.yamaha.com/files/download/other_assets/8/313438/tyros3_en_dl_v10c.pdf
https://de.yamaha.com/files/download/other_assets/6/314656/tyros4_en_dl_a0.pdf
https://usa.yamaha.com/files/download/other_assets/5/959965/tyros5_en_dl_d0.pdf
https://europe.yamaha.com/files/download/other_assets/3/1131013/genos_en_dl_f0.pdf
https://usa.yamaha.com/files/download/other_assets/8/2179948/Genos2_DL_En_A0.zip

Mark

[torben]

I just found these reviews on Facebook:

"My final thoughts on Genos2, after almost 2 weeks of ownership
You should buy this only if you don't have a Genos currently and wanted to have a light weight, arranger /keyboard with easy workflow, huge number of presets, right out of the box to play with, and of course if you are a diehard fan of Yamaha arrangers. Otherwise it's not worth the price to buy or even upgrade from Genos1(since it's only 10% improvement in my opinion )".

And here is another one:

"Genos 2: An overpriced , hyped- up , disappointment   , all these self important ,waffling on ,Yamfanboys on you tube running through the presets but doing / showing nothing creative ie  : style creator improvements , sound editing improvements , the things working pro musicians would want in a high end keyboard , that's because there really aren't any ,   only an idiot would be happy with the  "new styles " YAMAHA have included because most of them are 70s / 80s song specific , what good is that ? , the  only improvement I liked were to the drums which are basically the same but with tec that can alter the dynamics and EQ quickly and with no fuss, I copied a couple of these "new" styles with the relevant newer sounds ( excluding the FM sounds which won't copy ) and I can assure you after a bit of tweaking they sounded just as good on my Genos 1 , ......I lasted 4 days with the Genos 2 before making up my mind that YAMAHA whose products I'd always thought were excellent in the past had managed to shortchange me big time on this occasion....Luckily I have a great local music store who let me return it for a full refund ....let's hope Genos 3 will be the game changer Genos 1 was .....I confidently predict Genos 2 will have a short life span"

Just confirming me in deciding to wait for Genos 3. Genos 2 recalls me of an old fairytale of H.C. Andersen ...

Torben

[ton37]

LOL, OK, I can give you dozens more pros and cons. But who are you trying to convince? Yourself? Given your choice, you naturally look for what best suits your peace of mind. If you are happy with your choice, let the others be too... 

and... I don't believe in fairy tales 

[terryB]

I have had G2 for a few days now and my impression is it is a big step up in sound from G1 and I have not got around to tweeking settings to get the best results. I loved my Genos1, but I am sure going to love this more, don't regret the change at all.

Cheers Terry

[BogdanH]

.. But who are you trying to convince? Yourself?...

That's a very good question and I think that answer is many times: yes. Because it's in our nature that we seek for confirmation about our decision -in sense "if everybody says this keyboard is much better, then my decision was right". But was it really the right decision for you? No matter what the answer is, now we feel obliged to continue recommending "our" decision to those who are not sure what they wish or need.

What I'm saying is, no matter what keyboard we have, we should try to be objective at giving advice.

Bogdan

[EileenL]

Yes I agree,
  If you are not happy with new Yamaha products then go find something that dose all you want and leave the rest of us to enjoy our new Genos2  I am so sick of all this
putting down of keyboards which also puts users down and also insults our intelligence. This keyboard is not over priced. Indeed I paid under the price I paid for Genos six years ago. With all the price increases we have now I consider this a very good price.

[torben]

This site is overcrowded with people trying to convince others, that they have made a 200% right choice in buying/not buying a specific keyboard. OK, I believe that the most obejctive evaluation in this respect should come from people having tried that keyboard and given a critical review - pro et contra. It seems that a lot of members here are totally blind folded by the fact that they have spent their money on some new shining product. Even these players should maybe be able to see some flaws, look at my former post. Then the reviews would probably appear more credible. You ask "who are you going to convince - yourself?". Well, it goes 2 ways. So maybe we should stop any discussion of which keyboard is the best?
No one knows ...

Torben

[EileenL]

I never try to convince anyone in there choice. It is there's and no one else's. I will always advise spending time trying a keyboard before you buy but I will not run something down just because it has not got something I want on it. I will shop around and try to find it.

[Gunnar Jonny]

Great replies pro/con...also how do you new owners like the Keybed feel on G2?

In my opinion, the keybed is exactly as it is (was) on G1. I don't have them side by side since I sold G1, but can not say I sence any differences.
If I compare to Pa5X, then it's another story. When feel and look close at them, Yamhas seem a bit 'toyish', noisy and clickclack'ish in comparision... 
Anyway, I will put thumbs up for Yamaha regarding to that they still add printed manuals in the box!    Korg only deliver a Quick Start Guide. 

[BogdanH]

@Gunnar
That was also my impression (about keybed) when I tried G1 and Pa5X in store. However, because I got used to my SX700 keys, I actually preferred Genos's soft touch -but Pa5X keys gave more premium feeling.

Although initial keybed feeling is important and can be deciding factor for some, there's another characteristic: longevity of that feeling. SX900/700 is good example of what I mean: New SX900/700 has quite better keybed feel than new Pa1000 (in my opinion). But the problem is, after a year keys start rattling (is known issue) and so in long term Pa1000 wins -unless it also suffers some longevity illness.

Btw. You made interesting comment about printed manual... Speaking for me, I never opened it -I always use PDF 

Bogdan

[pjd]

I treat most "which keyboard is best" discussions in the same way I treat "which quarterback is the greatest of all time" discussions on sports TV -- I switch off.

Torben posted some of the rubbish messages that I've seen on other forums, diss'ing not only Yamaha, but every other vendor under the Sun. The bad grammar and spelling reveal much about the depth of thought. 

Serious criticism is always welcome. Chony's recent review is a good example.

Please, for your own sanity, don't take these insane rants personally. It's not worth it.

Stay centered, find peace -- pj

[Amwilburn]

In my opinion, the keybed is exactly as it is (was) on G1. I don't have them side by side since I sold G1, but can not say I sence any differences.
If I compare to Pa5X, then it's another story. When feel and look close at them, Yamhas seem a bit 'toyish', noisy and clickclack'ish in comparision... 
Anyway, I will put thumbs up for Yamaha regarding to that they still add printed manuals in the box!    Korg only deliver a Quick Start Guide. 

As far as I can tell, they're the same keybed. The Pa5x61/76 keybed, on the other hand, *is* even better feeling in my opinion (the 88 on the other hand...)

This site is overcrowded with people trying to convince others, that they have made a 200% right choice in buying/not buying a specific keyboard. OK, I believe that the most obejctive evaluation in this respect should come from people having tried that keyboard and given a critical review - pro et contra. It seems that a lot of members here are totally blind folded by the fact that they have spent their money on some new shining product. Even these players should maybe be able to see some flaws, look at my former post. Then the reviews would probably appear more credible. You ask "who are you going to convince - yourself?". Well, it goes 2 ways. So maybe we should stop any discussion of which keyboard is the best?
No one knows ...

Torben

If you've successfully convinced yourself not to buy a G2, then congrats on your decision, I guess?
I'm personally not trying to convince anyone 1 way or another, believe it or not; I *still* have new (and now used) G1's I need to clear through.

On paper, the only new features I saw were more polyphony, improved pianos (1 is only slightly better than the original G1, the other is vastly improved, but really still only on par with Pa5x's) and new Reverb. Whoop di do.

It wasn't until I started to dig into it that I found more and more surprising differences. I'm just reporting the facts. (That's always been my job, btw).

I invited one of my G1 customers out to try the G2, and at first he didn't see any difference either. Until I showed him where the differences *were*, and then he was taken aback as well.

Mind you, it depends where your interest lie: He was playing mostly pop music from the 70's styles, where the difference *is* there, but not as nearly noticeable. It's not until you add the stuff that *needs* a synth or orchestras or a really rich piano (or pretty much any style that uses the 18 new kits over the G1) and *boy* is there a big difference.

Especially since I'm also a style programmer, having drums *even better* than Revo drums is a godsend, as well as authentic synth basses.

If you're like me, and everything is 80's/90's/2000's pop & rock, or Orchestral (from Sinatra to John Williams) then there's a *huge* difference. The G2 was aimed squarely at my interests; it might not be aimed at yours? But to claim there's no difference is a lot like saying there's no difference between the various Tyroses. (Tyrii?)

Do I like the Korg PA5x? Yes. It's build quality (casing and keys) are considerably better, and the piano sound is even on par with G2!
It's the lack of proper pedal advanceable registrations (on Yamaha you can chain 1000 registrations together if you desire; most I've used is 73 for 1 song; My Pirates of the Caribbean medley uses over 50 changes) and the lack of downloadable samples other than Indian and Middle Eastern, that's why I focus on Yamaha.


*I* was trying to convince myself to get the G1, not the G2 as it's over $2k less. But it turns out that side by side, orchestrally or with 80's music, they're not even in the same sound league. Which is bad news for me; the Mrs will *not* appreciate the sudden price jump in the keyboard I asked for, especially when she feels "I just bought one" (the s970, which is now almost 7 years old! It's hard for her to compare though, since our townhouse is *cluttered* with instruments, including 6 guitars 2 ukuleles and a drum it :p). And I *haven't* spent my (recent) money yet.

Don't take anyone else's word for it, try it for yourself if/when you get the chance!

Mark

[Gunnar Jonny]

.....Btw. You made interesting comment about printed manual... Speaking for me, I never opened it -I always use PDF 

PDF is fine in many ways, and when it comes to revisions and additions it's absolutely OK.
But I'm of the old school who likes to sit in the armchair and browse the real paper format. It even happens that user manuals are included as bedside reading when there is a lot of new things to digest. 

[Dutchman]

I'm still in debate whether to upgrade from G1 to G2, 3000euros on top of my G1 is a lot of money.
I was able to try the G2 and it did sound better as far as I can tell, the problem was that the G2 was connected to some realy good speakers, I use the gns-ms01 at home on my G1, I simply don't have the room for big speakers.
I've asked if they could install the gns-ms01 on the G2 and coming week I can try them out, they'll even put the G1 right next to it so I can compare the two, great service if you ask me.
They understand the dilemma and offer the opportunity to make my own judgment.

I was sceptical about the G2 at first but you can't realy judge an instrument like that by watching YouTube or even a demonstration, you have to see/hear it for yourself.
Some critics written here are nothing more then bashing on something you don't like and most likely haven't even tried, yes maybe yamaha could've brought some changes from the G2 to G1 by a software update but why would they, it's like asking for the interior of a 2023 car to be installed into your 2020 model of that car because it has more options, it probably could've been done but it just isn't how things work.

A friend of mine traded his sax for another one, way more then 3000euros price difference, the old one sounded very good to me but the new one is much better according to my friend and he loves playing it so much more.
Who am I to criticize him and tell him that he spent to much money on to little difference, the new sax sounds awesome btw.

BTW, good musical instruments are expensive for a reason, they sound good.
If the G2 realy sounds better compared to the G1 then I will take the plunge, music is all about sound and that's what matters most to me, that and having fun making music.

[EileenL]

Genos2 will certainly bring you fun and a lot of enjoyment playing.

[Dutchman]

Genos2 will certainly bring you fun and a lot of enjoyment playing.

The G1 already does that but a bit more fun and enjoyment never hurts, and it's not like I will have to make this choice again in just a couple years from now.

I'm realy looking forward to trying out and be able to compare the two.
I know the people at the store will help me point out the differences of the G2 and where to find them.
My ear is my best friend though, if the G2 realy sounds better then the G1 then I'm in.
I'm realy curious about the new reverb and drums, they sounded great during my first tryout, I hope the gns-ms01 speakers will be able to represent these changes in a good fashion.
I'll be bringing a USB stick with my registrations as well so I can see how they translate to the G2.

[Amwilburn]

They understand the dilemma and offer the opportunity to make my own judgment.

I was sceptical about the G2 at first but you can't realy judge an instrument like that by watching YouTube or even a demonstration, you have to see/hear it for yourself.
Some critics written here are nothing more then bashing on something you don't like and most likely haven't even tried, yes maybe yamaha could've brought some changes from the G2 to G1 by a software update but why would they, it's like asking for the interior of a 2023 car to be installed into your 2020 model of that car because it has more options, it probably could've been done but it just isn't how things work.

A friend of mine traded his sax for another one, way more then 3000euros price difference, the old one sounded very good to me but the new one is much better according to my friend and he loves playing it so much more.
Who am I to criticize him and tell him that he spent to much money on to little difference, the new sax sounds awesome btw.

BTW, good musical instruments are expensive for a reason, they sound good.
If the G2 realy sounds better compared to the G1 then I will take the plunge, music is all about sound and that's what matters most to me, that and having fun making music.

Agreed. *All of this*. Also why I arranged them in the store next to each other.
Listen and make your own judgement *not* from Youtube, in person.
I wasn't expecting much difference either. I was very surprised.

Mark

[ton37]

I'm still in debate whether to upgrade from G1 to G2, 3000euros on top of my G1 is a lot of money.
I was able to try the G2 and it did sound better as far as I can tell, the problem was that the G2 was connected to some realy good speakers, I use the gns-ms01 at home on my G1, I simply don't have the room for big speakers.
I've asked if they could install the gns-ms01 on the G2 and coming week I can try them out, they'll even put the G1 right next to it so I can compare the two, great service if you ask me.
They understand the dilemma and offer the opportunity to make my own judgment.

..........

I completely agree with you. The quality of the sound is the most important audible metric that differentiates keyboards from each other. If there is high quality in it, it should also be able to come out. You can only literally hear that if you also connect good speakers to it. The GNS-ms01 are reasonable speakers, but I didn't like (the sound of) the Subwoofer. That's why I chose a set from Yamaha, the HS7. Tmo. they are not 'so' big? They transmit the frequencies clearly and are powerful enough for the low tones, making a subwoofer unnecessary. In my opinion, they do justice to the sound potential of the Genos2. At least that is my opinion, and of course taste is always something personal. Naturally, other brands also have excellent speakers. Jm2c. In other words: if you are going to listen, ask if your dealer can, for example, place a set of HS7 next to it so that you can compare it with the GNS-msO1 set.  Your ears are your jury.... 

P.S.: reminder: the G2 has a preset-eq for the HS7.

[alvaromrocha]

I've now found 2 downgrades as well: (well technically only 1:)

1) the OLED to LCD screen (already mentioned), loses readability; no true black
2) THe BigBandBrass SW which is an orchestral brass ensemble with solo shake trumpet when at high velocities; in the previous versions, there were separate shake trumpet panned left and right (indeed, the samples even ended at slightly different times), they've now reduced it to 1 single shake trumpet, center panned... because the sound is now in mono (same as it was on the CVP505 and PSRs950)...
*Update* no wait, turns out it's the *insert* effect making it mono; remove it and the sample itself is still in stereo. What the heck?  That seems like a *really* bizarre oversight/choice.

3*) Not a downgrade, but I expected a new Tutti after 20 years. Nope, same one.
They *did* add a couple of new brass tutti's (which sound incredible) but neither has the Timpany/Crash added.


Overall I'm still really impressed with how it sounds overall compared to all other keyboards on the market, but there have been some odd choices too.


If anybody thinks G1 and G2 are the same, you must thing G1 and T5 are the same, and T5 and T4 are the same, going all the way back to T2 (which was clearly a huge difference from T1 to T2). Which subsequently means you think the T2 and the Genos2 are the same; keep in mind TravelinEasy transfers all these files to his s950, which is *below* a T2 (but above a T1, and with the drums of the T4/T5, albeit in mono) in chipset. Yup, one of the biggest differences from T1 to T2 to T3 to T4 was the new drum kits ; T4 to T5 added 2 (specialty percussion kits), then G1 added 10 Revo kits, 20 new kits in total.


The G1 had revolutionary (no pun intended) Revo drums; on the G2, those Revo drums are all in the Legacy folder. The G2 has at least *17 new kits* that I've found, including a *new* Revo kit; and the G1 legacy versions got named 2 or 3 (EDM Kit 2).

By comparison, the T2 added 2 kits to T1, T3 added 3 kits to T2 drums, and T4 added 10, which was part of the huge jump we talk about.

T2 only had 19 kits, 2 of which were SFX
T3 had 22
T4 had 27 + 7 in legacy for 34 total
T5 had 30 + 6 in legacy for 36 total (I believe the 2 extra were Pop Latin 2 and cymbal)
G1 has 47 + 9 in legacy for 56 total (G1 was indeed a huge jump)
G2 has 57 + 17 in legacy (which include the 10 Revo from G1! The Ambi kits and revo kits are completely different samples) for *74 kits in total*!
which means there are *18* new kits, I must've missed one of the new ones.

I did *not* include gospel ad libs, otherwise T4 and newer gets 1 additional kit.

Here are the voice list links for you to checkout yourself, but *anybody* who's played arrangers for a while knows that the *big* jumps are signalled by drum kits. And this is the 2nd biggest jump: like I said, this easily clears the jump from T2 to T3; 2nd only to the jump from T5 to G1 *on paper*.

https://uk.yamaha.com/files/download/other_assets/7/313437/tyros2_en2_b1.pdf
https://usa.yamaha.com/files/download/other_assets/8/313438/tyros3_en_dl_v10c.pdf
https://de.yamaha.com/files/download/other_assets/6/314656/tyros4_en_dl_a0.pdf
https://usa.yamaha.com/files/download/other_assets/5/959965/tyros5_en_dl_d0.pdf
https://europe.yamaha.com/files/download/other_assets/3/1131013/genos_en_dl_f0.pdf
https://usa.yamaha.com/files/download/other_assets/8/2179948/Genos2_DL_En_A0.zip

Mark

All those "jumps" mentioned could be done on the Genos 1 with just a software update, but then you woudn't shell out 5k.

Also regarding posts after that trying to justify the shell iut, it's the exact same FSX keybed and the exact same audio hardware snd the same DSP chips (yes, the Genos 1 HAS FM-X generatirs, they just aren't used by the software).

The only hardware "jump" was mostly cosmetic.
Genos 1 has been left crippled intentionally by discontinuing it, which is the ONLY (artificially created) reason to upgrade by pre-owners to the 2, compatibility with future packs leaving Genos 1 in the dust.

That's the rant reason!
You new PRO users will get it, the rant, by Genos 3, which will exist if enough current users keep rationalizing upgrades in the same freudian wife-proof way, ending up with an extremely outdated, albeit great sounding, same keyboard all over again... In the age of AI.

[BogdanH]

I agree with those who recommend to try & listen the keyboard in store (instead on Youtube). But be aware that human brain can easily be fooled by what we hear. For example, it's a fact that if one of two keyboards is slightly louder, then that keyboard will be automatically perceived as having "better sound". Again, I'm talking about very small difference in loudness (1-2dB). When difference is that small, we don't detect it as difference in loudness, but as difference in sound quality.
In short, it's impossible to judge sound quality difference (between two similar keyboards) in store. If we do hear the difference, then that's either because of different settings or simply because we want one of those two keyboard to be better.
I think, the only way to make a subjective judgement (for each one personally) is, to compare new keyboard with the one we have, at home. I know, that's rarely possible.
Btw. I am talking about comparing two similar sounding keyboards (i.e. Genos1 vs Genos2 or SX900 vs SX700).

Just my 2c,
Bogdan

[ton37]

Yes, we have smart brains and clever ears. So it's not (always) the gear, it's your ears. 

When the sound is quiet, you hear the midrange, but you don't hear the bass and the treble. As you increase the volume, bass and treble are easier to hear. Your ears only have a flat(-ish) frequency response at extremely loud levels of sound. (age-related?)
This is why many people use headphones at unhealthy levels of volume, damaging their ears in the long run - because it sounds more fun.
But yes, turning up the volume makes everything seem more revealing (be it that 'frequency' and 'volume' are 2 different dimensions in soundsources). 

[BogdanH]

...
When the sound is quiet, you hear the midrange, but you don't hear the bass and the treble. As you increase the volume, bass and treble are easier to hear...

-exactly.
Here are curves at various loudness of healthy human hearing (at young age):



..and it gets worse as we get older, where most hearing loss is at higher frequencies.

Bogdan

[Dutchman]

Sheesh, you guys realy don't make it easier for me comparing the two.
I'm 57 and as far as I know my hearing is pretty okay, it probably isn't as good as 20 years ago but I don't realy notice it, or don't want to admit 

I'll just go to the store and take my time comparing the two, they'll both have the same speakers plus I take my good headphones with me.
In my humble opinion a good sound has to do with different aspects, clarity, sound color, detail, etc.
I think there will be enough to compare to make a fair judgement for myself.

@alvaromrocha
Why are you so persistent in burning the G2 as you do, and the ones buying it, it looks like you're on a crusade, on a yamaha fan forum at that, you obviously don't like the G2 that's clear, so don't buy it, simple.

I can judge for myself how to spend my money thank you

Do you also complain that loudly when buying a coffee machine to find out two months later that the new model can make a double espresso instead of a single?

[EileenL]

I am sure you are going to like what you hear. The clarity of sound is beautiful and the new styles using new drum kits are great.
  I to get sick of people running down Yamaha and suggesting that we are fool for buying it. I can't understand why the Moderators do not remove these people.
  They are as useful as a chocolate tea pot. Hope you have a good time trying the keyboards

[torben]

A member calls  for removal of "these people"  because they dare to criticise Yamahas products!

How low can you get?

Torben

[EileenL]

It is some of the very insulting and unkind comments made towards members that I am not happy with for buying these keyboards. To say that I am low is also an insult.
  Would have thought you knew better.

[mikf]

Eileen
I think you may be over-reacting a bit. I see some people criticizing the Genos 2, and saying they wouldn't buy it. That's fair if that's what they feel. But I don't see them directly dissing those who do buy it, which would be unacceptable.
Having said that, some of the negative stuff about Yamaha and people's expectations versus reality do verge on the ridiculous. I have never tried the G2, but to me it seems very predictable to me. Yamaha have made enough improvement to stay very competitive in the TOTL space, and produced a great instrument, without being mind blowing. It's what they always do.
Mike

[Hawklord]

I personally don't think that Eileen is over-reacting at all.
Regarding the moaners and groaners on this forum, try before you buy and if you don't like it buy something else instead, simples, nothing more to be said. However if you have purchased one and are not happy, it is not the fault of Yamaha but 100% yours for not doing your homework on the product and wasting your money.
I traded in my Genos 1 for the Genos 2 which was delivered today and after a spending just a few hours playing with it all I can say is WOW the sounds to me are incredible and I have absolutely no regrets whatsoever in what I paid for the upgrade.
It is very sad that nearly every post gets infected at some point by negativity as there is a wealth of good knowledge here.
   

[BogdanH]

@Hawklord
What purpose would a forum have if we all would praise whatever Yamaha puts to market? At least we should try to be objective with pluses and minuses  -otherwise forum content has no informative value at all.

As Mike (above) said, nobody is criticizing owners of one or another keyboard. Genos2 is definitely the best keyboard Yamaha made so far. But as is to be expected, successor is always compared to it's predecessor: what is better and by how much. And here the differences should be clearly explained, because what is big improvement for you, is not necessary important improvement for others -that's why we come to "is it worth?" question.

Bogdan

[GrannyRocks]

Of course people have a right to evaluate a product and give their opinion. But that's not what Eileen is talking about, I believe. There are people who are on a crusade to diss Yamaha and by extension the fools who are buying the G2, meaning us. I suspect these people have two purposes. First, they are looking for attention. As long as we continue to respond and argue with them, they are getting what they want. And second, they are trying to prove to themselves and others that they are superior — in the know, too smart to be fooled. Otherwise, why would they continue to make the same points over and over wherever they can find a venue for their "critiques?" This Board is so valuable, because there are many people here to offer genuinely helpful information for those of us who need it. That can be information about how to use the G2 or information about the G2 that can help guide people in their decision whether or not to buy it. But then it also attracts people who have emotional needs to be heard or respected and who are trying to meet those needs on this and other forums. My first reaction is to be annoyed. But I also try to remind myself that they are human beings who are looking for something they are not able to get or to take in in their regular lives. So, to be clear, this is not about whether or not people can give their honest opinions. It is about the motives behind this constant bickering. And, by the way, as someone else pointed out recently, those of us who have bought the Genos2 also have an emotional need to justify our behavior. Human beings are not as rational as we like to pretend.