AUDIO-RECORDER problem

[PierreSW]

Hey!
Now I have been in contact with Yamaha several times.
Ever since May 2020 (Yamaha Denmark) and now no later than August 2021 (Yamaha EU) until now with my problem with AUDIO-RECORDER.
Has sent 5 songs to them with different problems in the recording. Hack, several very short accelerations then back to normal and sync issues.
But I get no answer as to what Yamaha should do about it.
Is there anyone else who has the same problem I have,
so please tell your Yamaha supporter so the Japanese can fix this, what more can I do? I do not know how to proceed with this.

Sends with the last song I recorded with sync issues

https://app.box.com/s/lyc1ilr59770s21afh5ti0ycw3ig70fj 

Regards Pierre

[Stijn]

Hello Pierre,

My friend Jean-Marie (Belgian) who lives in Spain has the same audio problem. He records his songs and makes YouTube clips.
To solve his audio problem he sends his Midi recordings to me and I do the audio recording on my Genos. (There are other ways to record, but this is the way we do it.)

We tried to fix it by resetting the keyboard and by downgrading the Genos to version 2.1, but nothing worked. Maybe it's a hardware problem....

Regards

[Toril S]

I am very disappointed that Yamaha did not respond to you! What about the store? Can they help?

[EileenL]

Sounds like lots of effects are being used and sometimes they are on the style and sometimes not. With any Yamaha keyboard it is always best to record in Midi. Then you can adjust things like quantize panning volume effects  etc. Once happy with then record the midi to Audio.
  I can't say I have ever heard of this problem before. I have recorded hundreds of songs and never had a problem like this.

[Toril S]

I do ad Eileen does, record to MIDI first, and then play the MIDI file while recording to audio. When you do that, is the problem still there?

[Stijn]

Eileen, Toril

Yes, the first recording is Midi and its sounds just fine when played back.

Then the Midi is recorded to audio (on my friend's Genos). This audio recording doesn't sound the same as the Midi, it has sudden short accelerations and some kind of hick ups.
Playback of this audio on a PC or HiFi produces the same problems.

When I use my friend's Midi and record it to audio on MY Genos, there is no problem, it sounds exactly the same as the midi. So the problem lies with my friend's Genos.

Stijn

[Amwilburn]

ok, the audio rendering is on a Genos; is it using the SSD? or is he using a USB stick?

I've experienced the same thing on a CVP using its internal flash 'hard drive'... shocking that my USB (admittdley 3.0) stick could keep up with the .wav recording, but the internal flash memory was too slow (thus producing skips). If he's audio rendering to the SSD, that should be fast enough, it's possible the drive needs to be cleaned up (if it's too full, and fragmented, that can degrade its rec speed)

[Fred Smith]

I saw agree. Sounds to me like the disk is fragmented, and needs to be degragged.

Cheers,
Fred

[PierreSW]

Eileen, Toril

Yes, the first recording is Midi and its sounds just fine when played back.

Then the Midi is recorded to audio (on my friend's Genos). This audio recording doesn't sound the same as the Midi, it has sudden short accelerations and some kind of hick ups.
Playback of this audio on a PC or HiFi produces the same problems.

When I use my friend's Midi and record it to audio on MY Genos, there is no problem, it sounds exactly the same as the midi. So the problem lies with my friend's Genos.

Stijn

Hey Stijn!
That's exactly how it is for me too.
Can you ask your friend to report this to Yamaha.
I know 3 more who have the same problem.
Yamaha must correct this. The problem seems to come the more you have recorded,
because it worked when Genos was new.

Regards Pierre

[PierreSW]

ok, the audio rendering is on a Genos; is it using the SSD? or is he using a USB stick?

I've experienced the same thing on a CVP using its internal flash 'hard drive'... shocking that my USB (admittdley 3.0) stick could keep up with the .wav recording, but the internal flash memory was too slow (thus producing skips). If he's audio rendering to the SSD, that should be fast enough, it's possible the drive needs to be cleaned up (if it's too full, and fragmented, that can degrade its rec speed)

If it's this way, Yamaha should fix this with an update that fixes it to all their keyboards.

Regards Pierre

[PierreSW]

Is there any way to make a DEFRAG the user memory in Genos?
Maybe the solution to this problem.

// Pierre

[overover]

Is there any way to make a DEFRAG the user memory in Genos?
Maybe the solution to this problem.

// Pierre

Hi Pierre,

Flash memory devices like the Genos User drive (it's a so called eMMC memory chip) or USB flash drives don't need to be defragmented. This would not bring any benefit, it would only reduce the life time.

Please check that the User drive is not completely/almost full. The same applies to the USB sticks used. Ideally, several GB (gigabytes) should be FREE.


P.S.
If this does not lead to success (not even the use of a suitable USB stick), I recommend performing a complete factory reset on the Genos. There is a special key combination for this, so that the internal test program does NOT have to be called here. With this factory reset, ALL internal RAM and ROM memory areas are deleted and reset to the factory settings. (Backup your user defined system settings and the content of the User drive before!)

If you need detailed information on this, just write me a PM (Personal Message).


Best regards,
Chris

[PierreSW]

Hey!
I think I found what causes the error on the AUDIO RECORDER.
Has transferred all Genos files to the computer, and the Audiorec.root file is a "hidden folder"
that must be accessed via the control-panel of the computer to be able to see.
So there I have a backup now of all the songs I recorded before.


There were too many songs there, so the memory went to the ceiling.
I have removed all the recordings (1.10 GB) there in Genos, and now it seems ok with the recordings.

In the AUDIORECORD folder when you are in Genos, you can not move the files to the USB memory,
the only way is to delete the files in Genos, to make room for more recordings.



// Pierre

[overover]

Hey!
I think I found what causes the error on the AUDIO RECORDER.
Has transferred all Genos files to the computer, and the Audiorec.root file is a "hidden folder"
that must be accessed via the control-panel of the computer to be able to see.
So there I have a backup now of all the songs I recorded before.

There were too many songs there, so the memory went to the ceiling.
I have removed all the recordings (1.10 GB) there in Genos, and now it seems ok with the recordings.

In the AUDIORECORD folder when you are in Genos, you can not move the files to the USB memory,
the only way is to delete the files in Genos, to make room for more recordings. ...

Hi Pierre,

The hidden folder "Audiorec.root" contains all data that were created with the Audio Multi Recording (internal .AUD format; one folder per recording project, which contains various .wav and control files). The content of this folder should NOT be changed manually by the user (via USB storage mode)! Normally, Audio Multi recordings that are no longer required should be deleted directly in the Audio Multi Recording mode. Finished Audio Multi recordings can be converted there into .wav format, i.e. exported to a USB stick.

Recordings made with Audio Quick Recording (.wav format) are automatically saved in the "root" of the User drive (automatically generated file names "Audio_<3-digit number>.wav"). These can be deleted at any time via USB Storage Mode (or moved to the computer). Did you also consider these .wav files?

I do NOT think that the "Audiorec.root" folder (or its size) was the real reason for your problem, but rather that there was only a relatively small amount of space available in the User drive in total. You can check the used/available storage capacity of the User drive either in "Utility > Storage" or via USB storage mode on the computer. Have you already done this?


P.S.
Should I still send you the detailed information about the full Factory Reset via PM?


Best regards,
Chris

[PierreSW]

Hey Chris!
Yes, I understand how it is built, but have never encountered this with all the Tyros 1 to 5 that I had with the memory to quarrel in the AUDIO-RECORDER.
I am happy to receive the hard reset document, if needed in the future.
Thank you very much for all the good information.

Regards Pierre

[EileenL]

The User memory on Genos is 58.21 Gb. I have well over 400 Audio Songs I have recorded on mine as well as hundreds of Styles and other stuff and still have 37.67 Gb left.

[PierreSW]

The User memory on Genos is 58.21 Gb. I have well over 400 Audio Songs I have recorded on mine as well as hundreds of Styles and other stuff and still have 37.67 Gb left.

Hi Eileen!
I've been talking about AUDIO MULTI RECORD all along.
And there it seems that memory is limited.
I had used 1.10 GB and then it crashes for me.
Otherwise I had 56 GB of free memory in USER.
So there's something weird about memory management, at the MULTI RECORDER.
But now I know how to handle the memory in the MULTI RECORDER, so it does not hit the ceiling.
Regards Pierre

[Stijn]

@ Pierre

This is what I found on Eileen's forum:

Well, I finally managed to get the midi to audio recording problem solved today.

I spoke to Adam at E Pianos, from whom I bought my keyboard. He admitted that he had never come across this problem and suggested I do a soft reset which I duly did. Still the problem was there. The audio playback was still skipping and jumping, but in different parts of the song on each different playback. He contacted the Yamaha help desk who also had never come across the problem. They suggested I copy the audio file to email to them so they could try to find a solution. It was even suggested that a new circuit board may be necessary. When I copied the file to USB and tried it in my PC, the message "corrupt file unable to read" came up. So I tried another USB stick, and BINGO, the file played perfectly from the User with no hiccups. I put the original USB stick back into the keyboard and played the audio track again and would you believe the hiccups came back. I spoke with Adam again and he suggested that the original USB stick was probably corrupt and was effectively causing an intermittent short circuit within the keyboard. Had he not suggested copying the file to send to him and Yamaha, we wouldn't have found the problem!

I've now replaced the USB and I'm pleased to report that all appears to be working well again. I hope that this may help others if they encounter any baffling problems of a similar nature.

https://www.yamahakeyboardplayers.com/viewtopic.php?p=114975#p114975

Stijn

[JohnS (Ugawoga)]

Hi
I had a tyros 5 midi recording and put that into the Genos via a USB2 stick and the keyboard would not function properly.
I patiently managed to get all songs saved on a usb hard drive.
Even as i was trying to save things, i had glitches on the keyboard all over the place and it was like it had lost it's memory. I had to save each and everything singularly. as the keyboard kept freezing. Had to keep restarting.
After some help here i did a soft recover and all was fine again. So simple the solution after painstakingly trying to rescue all of my sounds registrations and songs.
Somehow the Tyros midi file corrupted the machine.
For me the biggest moan on the Genos is letters fading on buttons.
I only have a forward slash worn out on the start button , but others have had several buttons degraded.
This should not happen on a £5000 keyboard.
That is life though,.

All the best
John

[EileenL]

Hello John,
  My Genos gets a fair old bashing with the use of button pushing but there is not a sign of wear on any of the lettering. I do though have very dry skin.

[JohnS (Ugawoga)]

Hi Eileen

Yes some have better buttons than others as all the rest of mine have not faded.
I did notice that the print on number 2 registration has a very thin base.
All depends on which batches they came from
I must admit dry skin goes hand in hand as you get older  and having scoriasis behined my ear and elbow makes to itch like hell.
I use Farmology Pink grapefruit which comes in a dispenser or tube from boots.
It smells nice and it works on scoriasis ,but you have to keep it up. I get dry skin in my ears and that is bothersome wearing headphones. Itch, Itch and more itcthing!!!!
I have got three songs to output which needs a final mix , ear infection has put me back a couple of weeks. I am so happy that it is all clearing now.
Also very have i passed the dental checkup again!!
Well, ears are similar to an audio recorder, so not too much off subject as if someone will pull me up on it


All the best
John
Ps Nice relaxing night tonight with a glass of whisky and ginger ale and hopefully  will watch live in my executive chair --Swindon Town to beat the pants off Mansfield. We did have a good go at Manchester City and Swindon Town have scored more goals against them than Manchester United. Fact.

[PierreSW]

@ Pierre

This is what I found on Eileen's forum:

Well, I finally managed to get the midi to audio recording problem solved today.

I spoke to Adam at E Pianos, from whom I bought my keyboard. He admitted that he had never come across this problem and suggested I do a soft reset which I duly did. Still the problem was there. The audio playback was still skipping and jumping, but in different parts of the song on each different playback. He contacted the Yamaha help desk who also had never come across the problem. They suggested I copy the audio file to email to them so they could try to find a solution. It was even suggested that a new circuit board may be necessary. When I copied the file to USB and tried it in my PC, the message "corrupt file unable to read" came up. So I tried another USB stick, and BINGO, the file played perfectly from the User with no hiccups. I put the original USB stick back into the keyboard and played the audio track again and would you believe the hiccups came back. I spoke with Adam again and he suggested that the original USB stick was probably corrupt and was effectively causing an intermittent short circuit within the keyboard. Had he not suggested copying the file to send to him and Yamaha, we wouldn't have found the problem!

I've now replaced the USB and I'm pleased to report that all appears to be working well again. I hope that this may help others if they encounter any baffling problems of a similar nature.

https://www.yamahakeyboardplayers.com/viewtopic.php?p=114975#p114975

Stijn

Hey Stijn!
Yamaha has answered me and asked me to remove all USB sticks,
and then everything works again, but then I had to write to Yamaha again.
See what I wrote to Nicolai. So something is incorrectly programmed in Genos.

Hi again Nicolai!
Now the error has come back, and then I have done as you have suggested and removed all the USB sticks.
Then it seems like it works to record on the AUDIO MULTI RECORDER.
It seems strange that the USB sticks should affect the AUDIO MULTI RECORDER because everything you record is on the USER part,
Have never experienced this phenomenon on all my Tyros 1 to 5,
Hope you find a solution to this, 🎹
Regards Pierre

[Stijn]

Thank you Pierre, I will forward this to my friend in Spain.

Regards,
Stijn

[PierreSW]

Hey Stijn!
Really hope Yamaha takes the time to go through Genos and
corrects all their programming errors, because there are more that I have notified Yamaha and that have not yet been corrected.
After all, Genos has been on the market for a few years now, so they have had time to check out their programming errors, you might think.
Regards Pierre