Expectations

[beykock]

Hi Joe H :

I really understand what you mean, Joe.

I wonder if " Power Users " go for an arranger keyboard
only ? Do they not want more than an arranger keyboard can offer them ?

A synth and/or a DAW might be a better, extra tool or option  to make their dreams come true.
They want to make " their own perfect OMB productions ".
IMHO.

Most arranger keyboard owners here are " Home Players ".
( 90% of our members somebody said here, recently ).
They are looking for the best CD sound, a plug-and-play, a reliable, a nice and easy " all-in-one " instrument.

For these people making music is a hobby not a
( semi )profession.
Hobby means for them " play, sing, have fun and ... relax ".
An arranger became a modern family instrument like an acoustic piano in the past, I guess.

" Home Players " might be Yamaha's main target group of favourite customers, who knows ?😉

Best wishes,

Babette

[panos]

Not a bad thing to ask for new features but doing it all the time and claiming that a model is bad or doesn't worth it's money because it doesn't have features that someone is asking for,although it could,sometimes make other users wonder why the Genos is not one of the best of it's kind and deserves such a bad criticism?

From my point of view there is never going to be a GenosvoicesPax4liveTyros5colourPhantomsoundsMontagefeature based keyboard
for lots of reasons.

Babette if you want to make the most extraordinary composition or cover or remix or whatever in a DAW, all you need is a mouse and the pc's keyboard.
Everything else (the notes,the sounds,the effects) is in your DAW.
A cheap midi keyboard or an expensive synthesizer is just optional to save you some time.

Some keyboardists feel that Yamaha overestimated and overpriced the Genos.
But let me ask you one thing?
After watching the video demonstration of Genos, after playing with it in a music store, after reading it's manual with it's "old" and "new" features you still have decided to buy it for some reasons.
Most of you have had already a Tyros or a PSR,so to understand what Genos can do or if it sounds better or not or whatever, should be pretty obvious to you.
So, better not to forget what those reasons were and not to forget that you had just 3 top models to choose from.
None of them had or has and unfortunately will never have all the features that we want....

Yamaha on the other hand must provide to Genos users better support (constant updates with improvements and new features? new features for live playing were those are necessary to be added? free packs? free styles? free midis?) as long as the Genos had,still has and will always have things  that should be working correctly.(Is there a software without some "bad" digits of 0 and 1? No Way!!!)

[EileenL]

I don't think there will ever be a keyboard that suits everyone's needs and that is why
a lot of people have more than one make keyboard.There are a lot of home players with Genos but also a lot of these do go out entertaining in care homes etc. As with anything you have to really explore exactly what your Genos will do and for me it is everything a sit and play entertainer wants to give a good performance and feel good about it. You make the keyboard what you want it to be.

[Lee Batchelor]

Good point, Eileen!

I think that true music producers use the Montage for their work, but it is a very complex beast. You just don't unpack it, set it up, and start producing tunes. The learning curve is huge!

On the other hand, we unpack the Genos and if you have even spent a few hours on a PSR or Tyros, you can have the Genos doing hoops and loops in five minutes! The Genos sounds are amazing, and the book even says you can record MIDI and audio!!! Whoo-hoo!! Problem: we associate the "instant gratification of being able to sit down and play a song right out of the box" with MIDI and audio recording. Well, it's not that simple. All of a sudden the learning curve got really steep. Next comes, "The Genos won't do what I want it to. It sounds as good as a Montage. What gives??"

So, I agree with those members who believe that the ultimate setup is to have a few different keyboards for different purposes. Imagine if Yamaha did achieve the keyboard that does it all? It would cost $100,000. And then, where would they go from "up?"

[mikf]

Imagine if Yamaha did achieve the keyboard that does it all? It would cost $100,000. And then, where would they go from "up?"

Never mind cost - it would be overkill and much too complicated for the vast majority of current buyers. In fact the Genos may already be getting close to that point.
You don't need a complicated keyboard with lots of bells and whistles to play great music or do gigs either. Just the right features, good sound and ease of use. There is a lot of demand for features from power users but they are a tiny minority. And power user does not necessarily = good player.
Mike

[Joe H]

Hi Joe H :

I really understand what you mean, Joe.

I wonder if " Power Users " go for an arranger keyboard
only ? Do they not want more than an arranger keyboard can offer them ?...

What I mean by power users is that someone is technical enough to exploit their instrument fully and make use of most or all of its features.  Whether that be a grande piano, a synthesizer, an arranger, the MIDI format, or a DAW.

Yamaha has published many Power User Guides over the years for those who want to be creative and not just plug and play.

Joe H

[EileenL]

As is said a good musician  can make the smallest and cheapest keyboard sound great. With Genos we can make what we hear sound better and that makes us want to be better players.

[travlin-easy]

I find it ironic that those who use synths and DAWs consider an arranger keyboard inferior to their gear, claiming that a pro musician would never use an arranger on stage. These are the same folks that spend endless hours working on each and every sound to make their instrument sound almost as good as any arranger right out of the box.

All the best,

Gary

[Lee Batchelor]

Yamaha has published many Power User Guides over the years for those who want to be creative and not just plug and play.

Is there one for the Genos?

[JohnS (Ugawoga)]

Hi
yeah!!
let us know when there is one for the Genos!!

With all those effects and layering new sounds in Yem ,drum programming etc a power guide would be useful.
Explaining how to integrate with Cubase  for the non techies. So much Yamaha could do and make money on selling book guides

[travlin-easy]

Unfortunately, people no longer read! And that's a fact, at least read things that are printed on paper. Most of their information is garnered from Internet sources such as You Tube, Face Book, etc... I still have a couple thousand books here at home, but most of my reading these days is done on my tablet, mainly because it's a lot easier to hold than a 600-page book.

So, for you relatively young folks, the best thing for you would be a You Tub video of how to accomplish these things, but I'm to the point where I'm just too damned old to provide it for you, and for all my efforts, no one would be willing to pay the price of labor and production. So, if Yamaha doesn't come out with something to meet your specific needs, I guess your best option is to sit down at the keyboard, turn it on and begin exploring. Who knows, you might even turn on your video camera and teach others how to do this while you learn as well. Over the years, I found that the most fun I had with my arranger keyboards, other than being an OMB entertainer, was exploring the inner workings and discovering all the wonderful things I could do with this amazing instrument.

Good luck,

Gary

[beykock]

Hi Gary :

I like your splendid idea members should make instruction video's and upload them here to help others out !👍

Nowadays it is so simple to make a video. 🐵
It has not to be a Hollywood production. 😻

Thanks, Gary !
Best wishes, Babette

[Mike2]

After starting out with my 2 cents worth, this subject has grown tremendously.

If I were to ask this forum a hypothetical question, like how many of you would think a Genos 2 would solve all your wishful needs, what would the answer be? Of course this is all hypothetical, but could be also telling. Because when the next Genos comes out, what will be missing in that one?

[beykock]

Hi Mike2 :

When a new arranger keyboard is in the air,
( long ) wish lists  might always be seen here, as usual.
It became almost a tradition. See the past.

For the time being it looks like the Genos successor will not come ( so ) soon.
IMHO other Genos updates might have Yamaha's priority.  Not a Genos2.

Babette

[Kaarlo von Freymann]

"By the way, I don't think "nervous" was the translation, but if it was, I'm not."

I for one  did not get the impression you were, and even in case you had been, are we discussing what people were when posting ? As a fact available translation from Finnish more often than not gives a very misleading wording. I tend to believe that is the case with Rumanian.  The word nervous  as we say in Finnish  "oli päin prinkkalaa."  No good translation found     To beat about the bush does translate ok into German, but Finnish and Swedish translations are nonsense.

Cheers

Kaarlo

[EileenL]

Not expecting a Genos 2 for at least two years. Let us enjoy the one we have at the moment before more requests appear.

[Mike2]

I couldn't agree  with you more Eileen.  Even if the Genos 2 comes out in 2 years, we will have missed some if not much of what the Genos 1 had to offer. How will anyone handle the Genos 2?  My answer is the same as the Genos 1. So I say, just relax, and enjoy the moment, for that is all we have.

[EileenL]

Well John,
  Time will Tell but we must be grateful for what we have and enjoy life while we can.

[JohnS (Ugawoga)]

Hi Eileen
i am having a bad week!!

Firstly i left my camcorder at the Battle of the Proms at Blenhiem Palace.
Secondly i have downloaded 150 gig of sounds for Sampletank 4Max vst. Also took ages unzipping the files and then i go and delete the wrong folder
About a days worth of boring downloading gone up in an instant.

I wonder what the thied thing will be!!

Musn't Grumble"   aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaGGGGHHH!!   "Great Expectations"!!


All the Best
John

[Joe H]

It's really sad what's happened with this thread.  It's gone into a tail-spin nose-dive... complaining about the complaining.  The Moderators should have locked this thread... but instead they are participating in it. What's happened to this Forum, it used to be about helping each other learn about how to use their keyboards.

               



Joe H

[EileenL]

I agree Joe,
  The moderators here do not seem to mind what is posted and that at least four or five different threads have started up on the 1.40 update. They of course should have all been put into one. I think people now are getting more and more confused and some requests are getting silly and some quite insulting to Yamaha and its users that are quite happy with there keyboards but are made to feel that they are old and only home players anyway.
   I do believe that all these add on's Daws and computer generating music programmes should have a separate section where they can discus all the technical jargon so that those of us who only use our keyboards can go back to helping one an other get the best from them.

[travlin-easy]

As moderators, we do our level best to just keep things civil, while still maintaining the original intent of the forum, which is to assist Yamaha arranger keyboard players and owners to the best of our abilities.

We do not try to control the content of any thread, even when it strays left or south just as long as it remains civil and individuals do not attempt to insult or slander other members, or bring politics or religion into the fray. There is a complete list of forum guidelines with a link to them on the home page where members can get a good idea on what is and what is not allowed.

All the best,

Gary

[Lee Batchelor]

Some of these posts are about venting frustrations too. And let's face it - we may see no way to do a certain thing on the Genos, but then someone comes up with a workaround. That's productive.

We may go way off topic, but even when we've never met each other in person, save for a few exceptions, it's no different than if we were sitting in a coffee shop talking about things we wish we could do with our Genos keyboards. So, we're not too far off track.

I agree - there may need to be a separate section for "Cubase + Genos." That topic just bores the daylights out of the people who just love to sit and play .

[valimaties]

Hi all.

This is my last post on this forum.
Seems some old users and moderators are NOT pleased with the idea of modernization and upgrading of this keyboard, and in my opinion, upgrading every electronic device is almost 50-75% suggestions and (yes) complaining of users! If this not happening, nothing will be made!

For this reason, I think is not my place here.

I want to say nothing else more. 

Good luck and best regards,
Vali

[beykock]

Bad decision👎, Vali, but you are the decision maker : to stay or not to stay, that's not the question but your own decision.

Anyway ...
We will miss your critical but useful comments.🎩

Take care, Babette

[pjd]

Folks, folks, it's only the crummy Internet, not real life. 

Wishing everyone peace -- pj

[panos]

Vali, if someone takes a look at the "Genos General" board and read just the titles of the threads, the only thing he should think is that this keyboard "It just doesn't work!"

The new version doesn't work and it has changed things on the keyboard which shouldn't have been changed like styles,regs etc (this isn't true of course), other threads about how bad the Genos sounds (is it?), how many functions Tyros or Psr S have and Genos hasn't (what to answer to that?), how many functions Yamaha keyboard's don't have in general (how many functions and "stuff" other brands don't have really?),how bad the new styles and sounds are compare to older models (are we serious now?) and how bad and plastic the black colour is (no comments).

These are just few examples that I can remember right now that make some people wonder: "What the hell....Do I own another kind of Genos or something?"

It isn't that there is someone that doesn't want extra features.If he doesn't use a new feature,why should he mind if it is somewhere in the menu so those who want it, they can use it?
I don't think the "old" members are mad about suggestions but for the constant negative comments and threads again and again.
With other models people are asking for help to see if and how they can do some stuff with their keyboards.
In Genos' boards on the other hand, sometimes you feel like this machine is totally useless or something.

Vali,I believe that your suggestions for live playing are useful to us,as useful is your technical knowledge about keyboards and software in general.

[mikf]

As Gary says, moderators try to allow conversations to run even if they ramble, and do not step over our guidelines. However, I have removed one post on this thread because it was headed with a very blatant statement on a political matter completely unrelated to anything in this topic. I am sure the person concerned knows what this is and I ask them not to do this again.
Mike

[JohnS (Ugawoga)]

Hi
The title of this thread is Expectations.
This means there will be a lot of complaints .
Personally i find nothing wrong with the Genos and if people moan, they are entitled to.
Also a little light heartedness is a good thing and good old banter . I find also nothing wrong with that.
The thing is communication and a little fun is better than being serious. It makes the world go round.
Get into the Genos and open up a great tool. 
It will keep people off mobile phones!! Hopefully.

All the best
John

[elad770]

Guys, Please

I simply don't understand what is the Drama

Joe H , EileenL , Vali

Everything is Ok! No need to leave the forum or cry about everything.

I actually think the moderators are doing excellent work by allowing everyone to express themselves the way they feel

To date , i haven't come across ONE word or thread or topic that was so inappropriate and this is a big thumbs up to everyone here.

i think Gary put it best: Civil - That is all!  Threads might take different turns and spins especially when they are about an expected update to their keyboards and yes! people will complain

about whatever they want...... Just relax everyone. Those who feel they don't like the way a thread evolves, simply ignore it or open a new one!

the administrators are so nice and liberal about it.

I like members like Vali and others who complain. While I'm happy with my Genos these members fuel the fire that we call progress and modernization. Never had issue with any of the posts that are up.

Even the post that was removed, i would pass personally. The best way to erase a post or a thread in a free society is to ignore it and let it die on its own but i understand why they did it.
This should not be taken personally and everybody should just be happy.

there were few comments about: this forum used to be about helping ......etc.... (to suggest it's not the case anymore) - i WOULD LIKE TO SAY : PLEASE STOP WITH THIS CRAZINESS

This forum is by far the most supportive and helpful resource for any Yamaha user! Every thread that is put up get responses with help and resources and i simply don't
understand why people are not seeing that. almost as if this is a rich people problem where this forum is so good that people don't have anything better to do and complain about it

The organizers of this forum want to have and open discussion to include ALL OPINIONS and views! Some are negative some positive, some always constructive and some always complaintive. and yes ! some posts can only say: i don't like it without providing any constructive solution. So what? People...come on......

Just take it easy..... There are thousands of people here and all have a different opinion and personalities. I personally would like to see everyone express themselves they way they wish
without being shot down and again, i think the moderators are doing a fantastic job to allow us just that, as long as we are being civilized

You know what will be a great idea? I just thought about it: If I win the lottery i will organize an annual meetup of all active forum members. I will fly everyone into a beautiful resort
with their Keyboards! we can meet each other and share experiences! i think this will improve our cohesion and dynamics.

until then, let us all respect, everyone here and i definitely don't want to see members leaving the forum just because others don't like their style