Need more Mic volume on S975

[RoyceM]

I would appreciate some ideas from you S950, S97x owners.

With my S910, I could get all the microphone volume I wanted...and more.

But with my new S975, I can't get adequate volume without turning up the keyboard's master volume knob.

Here is what I currently do:

GUITAR/MIC SWITCH:  Set to Mic.

GAIN KNOB (Next to guitar/mic switch): Turned all the way up.

MIC ACCESS BUTTON:  Talk is turned off.

COMPRESSION:  Talk is turned on.

LEFT LIVE CONTROL KNOB:  Assigned to volume control, which controls the Mic setting (on the screen for controlling volume settings for Style, Pads, Left, Right 1, Right 2...) and is set to 127.

Have I overlooked something?

Thanks for your thoughts.

- Royce

[travlin-easy]

Make and model of mic?

[RoyceM]

Make and model of mic?

My mic is a SHURE SM58.

- Royce

[DrakeM]

Hi Royce,

I approach controlling the mic volume by turning the STYLE down. I have always said the keyboards are set up for playing the keyboard and not really for using the Mic and singing.

I set the style Master Volume for just the "style" at 68 and the Mic Master Volume at 100. This does require you to reset the OTS settings at a lower volume as well.

Then I turn the MASTER VOLUME knob for the whole keyboard at 75 percent.

It's not that the mic isn't loud enough ... it is the keyboard is too loud.

Regards
Drake

[travlin-easy]

While the SM58 was a great mic way back when, by today's standards it's at the bottom of the heap. It has very little gain, thus you will have to use some sort of booster to get the needed volume for that keyboard. You would do much better with a Samson Q7 or Q8, which sells for about $50 to $75 on most internet sites.

Good luck,

Gary :cool:

[RoyceM]

While the SM58 was a great mic way back when, by today's standards it's at the bottom of the heap. It has very little gain, thus you will have to use some sort of booster to get the needed volume for that keyboard. You would do much better with a Samson Q7 or Q8, which sells for about $50 to $75 on most internet sites.

Gary, I was hoping the problem wasn't something like this, but I think it has to be. Surely I've covered the relevant areas on the keyboard--unless somebody notices something I've overlooked.

I will read up on those microphones.

Thanks,

- Royce

[DonM]

The Samsons have a little more gain, as Gary said, but I've had no problem getting enough volume from SM58.  I don't use them any more, but i just plugged one in and tried it and it worked fine.
I have all the main settings at 100, including mic, but there is plenty of room to increase the mic volume.  You should NOT have to turn the input knob all the way up.  Are you certain the switch is in the MIC position?  Could it be broken?  Just fishing for possible causes, but it seems to me that the style settings may be set too high, as Drake suggested.
Also you might try resetting the mic settings to factory default.  Maybe the volume got turned down there somehow.  For example the mic/harmony adjustment might have gotten turned too far toward the harmony. 

[Patrick]

Hi Royce, a freind of mine have a S970 with the S SM58, and this Mic is very powerfull!just check if the mic settings is set to Mic/Guit in the  DSP section (Harmony button); if not the sound is very Week! Then adjust the volume of your microphone behind the keyboard as it must not be to loud! Try Garry's settings, very good choice; have you adjusted you're EQ settings? I hope you'll found the best settings, all the best Patrick

NB: Vocal harmony/Effects type/Assign part change Right 1 to Mic/Guit/Type: tempo echo (or try some others type)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QoUO6Ww1uR8 great Youtube not in english but easy to follow

[J. Larry]

No problems, here, with the S975----nor with the 970 and 950 prior to that.  I follow Drake's advice on balancing all factors to allow the vocal to cut through.  For mics, I'm having good success with the TC Helicon MP-75.  It rejects feedback issues very well.  I used the Shure Beta 58 for a long time.  Like the MP-75 much better.

[Paul B]

Royce,

I agree with Don and Gary, the sm58 in not a great vocal mic. Try  the EV Cobalt mic, I have 2 of these and they are great for the price. $59 at Guitar center.

Here is a link from Guitar Center.

https://www.guitarcenter.com/Electro-Voice/Co7-Cobalt-Vocal-Mic.gc

Paul B.

[DonM]

A different mic is most likely NOT going to fix this problem.   I believe it is something else.

[MarkF_48]

Look for mics with 'neodymium' magnets in the element. These will generally have  a higher sensitivity/output which is expressed in dbV/PA or mV/PA. The SM58 has a sensitivity of -54.5 dBV/Pa or 1.85 mV/PA. A few neodymium magnet mics will be up towards 2.2 mV/PA or higher and will need less gain in the preamp. A handheld style condenser may be even higher sensitivity. A few handheld condenser mics may use a battery so phantom power is not needed.

Most often the SM58 is used handheld by the singer and usually quite close to the mouth (kissing the grill) where higher sound pressure levels can create a higher output from the mic. Most here that play keyboard and sing may have the mic a bit further away which will need more gain from the preamp to compensate for a lower sound pressure level or a mic with a higher sensitivity.

A good site for mic specs.......
http://recordinghacks.com/microphones

A few commonly mentioned mics....
http://recordinghacks.com/microphones/Shure/SM58
http://recordinghacks.com/microphones/Shure/Beta-58A
http://recordinghacks.com/microphones/Samson/Q7
http://recordinghacks.com/microphones/Electro-Voice/Co7
http://recordinghacks.com/microphones/Electro-Voice/N-D767a

Another site that goes into mic sensitivity.....
https://www.behindthemixer.com/microphone-sensitivity-one-hot-microphone/

[DonM]

Some mics are definitely more sensitive than others, but I still maintain the SM58 shoud work. 
I have used one, also two Samsons, Q7 and Q8, three EVs, including 967, two Sennheisers, a lowly Behringer, and probably more that don't come to mind.  I am a mic freak.
Point is they all worked with several PSRs, including 8000, 2000, 2100, 900, 910, 950 and 970, and all that was necessary was adjusting the input knob.
Something either isn't set correctly or something is wrong.

[RoyceM]

Everybody,

I so appreciate all your thoughtful replies and information. I don't think I mentioned that I use the mic for PA only...I do not sing (the nicest thing I do for my audiences).

I'm going to do three things:

1. Check through everything on the S975 again.
2. Try a new mic cable that I have in storage.
3. If problem continues, I will take my mic to my local music store and try it on their demo unit.

I will report back.

Meanwhile, please let me know of other ideas you might think of.

Thanks again,

- Royce

[J. Larry]

Here's something I just tried with my S975 and it works very well.  I'm running a Shure Beta 87A condenser mic through a small, tube pre-amp (Art).  It has phantom power.  Then, run a ¼" cable output to the mic input of the S975.  Balance everything and presto, nice clean vocals.  Plenty of gain to work with.  Wouldn't it be great if Yamaha would put an XLR input with phantom power on the PSR models?  Maybe that's too much to wish for or expect.

[RoyceM]

Everybody,

I so appreciate all your thoughtful replies and information. I don't think I mentioned that I use the mic for PA only...I do not sing (the nicest thing I do for my audiences).

I'm going to do three things:

1. Check through everything on the S975 again.
2. Try a new mic cable that I have in storage.
3. If problem continues, I will take my mic to my local music store and try it on their demo unit.

I will report back.

REPORTING BACK

None of the above items was a solution. While at the music store testing my mic on their S975, the owner was sure there was another volume control somewhere...and he found it.

SOLUTION

The following gets you to another volume control:

1. Press Direct Access Button.
2. Press Mic Button.
3. Press Talk Tab (at top).
4. The volume control is at the bottom left of screen.

- Royce

[Paula]

Hi Royce;
Here are my EQ mic settings for my 970, maybe this will help :~)

[attachment deleted by admin]

[DonM]

Glad you found it.  I had forgotten about it I guess.  But I was 100% certain it wasn't because of the Shure mic.  I don't use it any more, but it has been the industry standard for more than 50 years.  Never thought about your having it in "talk" mode.
I did get a counterfeit SM58 once.  It still worked o.k. but had awful handling noise.
I still would think that a factory reset would have done the trick.
Glad you got to the bottom of it!

[RoyceM]

Paula Thanks for your settings. At this point, I'm welcoming all the help I can get in learning this environment that's so new to me.

Don Thanks for the interesting information about mics. I did try a factory reset, but things remained the same.

And another "thank you" to everybody who worked with me on this issue.

- Royce

[beykock]

Herewith I would like to thank all of you for the S975 feedback and support.

Babette

[Enildo]

Hello, RoyceM!
There is this video here from Brazil, where all volumes of the keyboard are explained.
It is in Portuguese but has some explanations in English.
I hope it helps.

Good luck,
Enildo

Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZhsiZzHmXE

[RoyceM]

There is this video here from Brazil, where all volumes of the keyboard are explained.
Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZhsiZzHmXE

Enildo, THANKS for sharing this link that explains another control I never would have known exists.

- Royce

[browzer]

Royce,

On the picture Paula posted of the EQ/Mic settings the compressor out setting is at 71, if yours is anything near that try setting it higher (eg. 120) for a good boost on mic volume.

Ronnie

[RoyceM]

On the picture Paula posted of the EQ/Mic settings the compressor out setting is at 71, if yours is anything near that try setting it higher (eg. 120) for a good boost on mic volume.

Ronnie

Thanks, Ronnie. I tried it and it make a significant difference.

- Royce

[Paula]

Hi
sounds as it working for you ,I think the out put makes a big difference !!! again  71 out with mic volume set at about 107  and mic guitar gain in back of key board set in center, is perfect for me,The mic you are using also is responsible for your volume I am now using a Electra Voice (EV)Nd 967  my opinion a great mic ,with a price of about $200.00 and have lots of mic volume
as Ronnie suggested  by boasting the volume in the mic mixer up it sounds as though you have solved your mic problem
        best regards
      Paula

[RoyceM]

Thank you, Paula.

I've not yet tried the new settings while doing a program. Even though tests at home are louder, I am concerned that I'm having to turn all 4 controls up to maximum (not counting the master control knob).

Couple this with the apparent MIC/GUITAR input switch anomaly (as I've noted in another thread) in which no volume change occurs when flipping the switch from guitar to mic, I am beginning to have serious thoughts that the S975 has a design or manufacturing flaw in which a pre-amp type of function for the mic is failing. Both my unit and the one in the music store behave similarly.

As I've said before, I really appreciate folks' input on this issue.

- Royce

[Paula]

Hi Royce
I have set my friends  mic up on his 975 using my 970 mic settings ,he is using a  low rated mic. all is well on his mic. volume although I needed to boast his mic out up some what in the mixer the picture of the settings I posted and his is working fine
    Paula

[RoyceM]

Hi Royce
I have set my friends  mic up on his 975 using my 970 mic settings ,he is using a  low rated mic. all is well on his mic. volume although I needed to boast his mic out up some what in the mixer the picture of the settings I posted and his is working fine
    Paula

Thank you for doing that test, Paula.

Monday I will get to hear my mic setup at a gig (my living room is an absolute sound sponge). I'm expecting to find things to be satisfactory now that I understand the various points of control.

Regarding my MIC/GUITAR SWITCH question, I spent some time at my local music store again today. The owner discovered that other models of keyboards behave the same now--no detectable volume change when flipped. So I must conclude that this is by design...end of question.

- Royce

[Jay B.]

I just went through the same thing on my new PSR-S970, trying to use a Shure Beta with a regular XLR-1/4" TS adapter. Not enough volume. I was searching through my things and found one of my old impedance matching transformers, and voila, the mic is working great through the keyboard now. Here's one available on Amazon:
https://www.amazon.com/CP8201-Microphone-Impedance-Matching-Transformer/dp/B0002CZYFC/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?s=musical-instruments&ie=UTF8&qid=1528598022&sr=1-1-spons&keywords=impedance+matching+transformer&psc=1&smid=A2O1A8NNN5Y1TU

The input on the 970 is high impedance and the SM58 is low impedance. You need the matcher to get the right sound. Hope this helps...

[RoyceM]

Hi Jay,

Thanks for sharing your experience. What a great addition to this discussion.

I wonder if anybody else has used this device.

- Royce