Drum Volume

[mgbchuck]

Howdy.... I was just wondering what else I can do to increase the volume of my drums on my tyros five. I go into my mixing console... Pick out the type of drums out I want to use... And use the mixer to increase the volume. After that.... I bring up the slider on my styles... to increase the overall style volume... To add more drums... And then I backed down the other instruments to a proper level.  I especially have trouble using a drum style with the brushes... It is just way too weak in volume... Even when I bring them up to a gain of 127. Is there something else I can do... I am sure that I am missing a proper technique to increase the drum volume. Any help... Would be greatly appreciated
Thanks.... Chuck Lyons

[PierreSW]

Hey!
Try to increase the volume via Dynamics Boost / Cut. See page 40 in tyros_en_rm_b0.pdf
> 100 lower <100 increases

Pierre

[TyrIA]

Hi !

The right way for controlling drums is to adjust them to sub output 1or 2 or both if you  need em stereo. Then you can turn on volume as loud as.....

TyrIA.

[jwyvern]

The way I enhanced drums on Tyros's (and now Genos) was to apply a suitable distortion DSP to them. With the right one, not just volume is affected, it can enhance the character by bringing out percussion from the samples you may not even know was there in the default sounds.
One of the best I found with Real Brushes was to assign US High Gain Solo in the Distortion group as a Style Variation/ System Effect effect with sends for most style parts at zero. Then turn up the Send on the drums to taste, usually in the 5 to 15 range. You can also turn up sends on other parts and assess the effects. Eg to get more thump on the bass.
John

[valio7771]

The way I enhanced drums on Tyros's (and now Genos) was to apply a suitable distortion DSP to them....

You're not messing around, do ya? Hahaha
That's like putting some sulphuric acid into the vinegar, to intensify vinegar's flavour. Or play a violin with a file instead of bow.

Jokes aside, in my personal experience...I always found Tyros's drums to be too much 'in-your-face' in the factory styles, and in general as well. I've always had the exact opposite issue, always have to tame them and let the rest of the arrangement be heard too. I'm genuinely baffled from the fact you guys have that issue at all, but hey...everyone has a different taste for sound, and that's OK by me.

[jwyvern]

You're not messing around, do ya? Hahaha
That's like putting some sulphuric acid into the vinegar, to intensify vinegar's flavour. Or play a violin with a file instead of bow.

Jokes aside, in my personal experience...I always found Tyros's drums to be too much 'in-your-face' in the factory styles, and in general as well. I've always had the exact opposite issue, always have to tame them and let the rest of the arrangement be heard too. I'm genuinely baffled from the fact you guys have that issue at all, but hey...everyone has a different taste for sound, and that's OK by me.

Some interesting analogies there Vali .
There are individual drums (eg kick) within some rhythms that need taming, maybe by cutting velocity, which I have had to do, especially if you do things to  "enhance" the overall. But my findings with many of the default rhythms with Tyros (I used mainly jazz and BigBand rhythms) was they often disappear into the mix if you allow them. This may have been by design to avoid upsetting the peace and quiet of the living rooms of original target customers!
Sometimes you need a bit of stronger acid to analyze what you are dealing with and what is possible, then you can back off to get sensible musical results. Hence the low sends I mentioned.
It surprises me you had problems taming drums on Tyros, was this with default setups or were you routing them through separate amplifiers? Perhaps the difference is in the type of music we play and the drums and percussion in your cases were set by default to be more prominent.

John

[panos]

Hi all,
Chuck is using 127 volume of the brushes and that is not enough?
Doesn't sound logical.
Is the EQ setting all the way down at the frequency that the brushes play is it  something  wrong with the usage of the slider's or all the channels of the style are playing at 120+ level?
Weird...

[valio7771]

Hey John,

Yes, probably I use the Brush kit less often than you I guess, because I do not play that sort of music as often.
And , No, I don't route the drums separately to the mixer, I just balance the volumes in the desired style that I would use for that particular song, and save it as a performance. Also I barely use any of the onboard EQ, maybe dial down a bit some frequencies that I've noticed have negative effect on the acousticst inside particular venue rooms where I perform on a regular basis, and I have those memorized as a User EQ entries that I can recall in a touch of a button. I only route my microphone to the mixer separately, so that the master volume of the keyboard won't affect the volume of my microphone, while still be able to regulate the volume of it from the sliders, and use the Vocal Harmonies and Mic FX from the Tyros. Basically there are 3 cables coming out of my keyboard (L+R+Sub1) to the mixer.

I believe using a Compressor instead of Distortion on the drums, will probably be a bit more 'musically appropriate' way to handle problems with dynamics and volume. Give it a try and see if it works for you. You probably know or heard about the 'golder rule' that applies for using EQ, FX or anything that alters the sound in some form....Less is always More!

Cheers

[panos]

The other thing I was thinking is to go style creator to the edit menu and check just the individual notes of the brushes and increase the volumes of them,
without having to change something that will affect the whole style or keyboard or even affect the other drum parts of the style.

[jwyvern]

Hi Vali,
We are probably not too far away from one another on the principles. On Genos it is possible to use compression for similar effects - ie. volume and bringing out some of the "hidden" percussion sounds using the input/ output parameters to control the amount. For example Medium or VCM compressors used as Insertion DSP's.
I would agree about "Less is more" and of course it's not just confined to music 

One day I will get around to substituting compression for distortion in some of my carryover rhythms from Tyros. My concentration at present is being commandeered by the fascinations and playing possibilities of V-console. 

John