Why Have I Not Bought A Genos Yet.

[Pianoman]

I have yet to see or test a Genos here.

1: Dealers will not bring them over without a commitment to buy one, sight unseen, and paying a deposit in advance.
In case of no deal, some cash may be deducted, for costs and trouble incurred for bringing the instrument over.

2: Genos prices are tumbling here, and I feel that if I wait long enough, they may tumble even further, down to something acceptable.

So far, they have come down from 4499€ to 3553€.
That's a saving of 946€.

3: When the T4 was launched, I didn't see much difference from my T3, especially with the styles, so I waited.

Then came the T5, the styles were still the same, so I waited.

Now it's the Genos, and the styles are still the same.....again.

4: An unforeseen family expenditure came up.

5: After reading about the countless problems with the Genos on this very forum, especially with the Genos crashing, freezing or hanging, I will wait until these, and other problems that have yet to be identified here, are remedied.

6: I am a patient man, Genos prices will fall even further.
When I first predicted in November that Genos prices will tumble, my argument, naturally, was hotly contested.

Used Genoses are slowly beginning to appear on second hand websites.
Being sold by those whose expectations have not been fully met.

So I will wait, even a year if I have to.
In the meantime I will make my T3 sing like a Nightingale whenever it's required to.

When I do acquire a Genos, it will not be as a status symbol, but as a work tool.
No more, and no less.

Best Regards.
Pianoman.

[Eric, B]

Hi Pianoman,
I upgraded from the Tyros4 to the Genos.
There are a lot of new styles there not found in the T3 or T4 (owned T3 as well).
There are a lot of new sounds over the T3 and T4. I mean a lot.
Plus all the styles are reworked and sound a lot better and use the newer improved voices.
For the first time I actually feel I am playing with a "Real Band".     
Thanks to the awesome new Revo Drums, new Bases, etc.
But I hear you, waiting til the prices go down more. 
For me the jump from T4 to the Genos was huge.
For you it should even be more...
Best regards
Eric

[Pianoman]

Hello Eric.

I just wanted to outline some reasons for not having bought a Genos.

Partly because I had to finance my son to go start a new life in Norway.
But also because I keep reading about so many bugs and problems that the Genos still has, especially the hanging and crashing.


As a live performer, it would be most embarrassing and traumatic to have an instrument freeze or crash in front of an audience.

I would never be able to trust, or feel comfortable with the instrument again,
if that were to happen to me.

And the prices are coming down Eric. As I said, I am patient.
I feel no urgency to acquire a Genos right away.

I suspect that even here, not all people are completely happy with their purchase, despite putting a brave face on it.

I will wait for the bugs to be fixed after they have been tested and pointed out.
And the downward trend of prices to continue.

Best Regards.
Pianoman.

[DrakeM]

Not much of a reason to get a new Genos as far as their on board styles, that is for sure.

Nearly all the styles are now available for you to tune to your current keyboard if you really want them. Unless there is a new feature on the keyboard you really want and know you would use, no reason to up grade.

The SA Guitar voices however are killer sounds, that would be a good reason to move up from a T3 to an S970 or the Genos, I think. That is if you use the guitar voices most of the time.

Regards
Drake

[Pianoman]

Hello Drake.

As you can see from my videos, I do use guitars a lot. The guitars on my T3 serve my needs perfectly for now.
Other voices that I use often are, Rock and Jazz organs, Saxes and Brass. That's basically all that I use.
And Soft Pad for the left hand.

Best Regards.
Pianoman.

[DrakeM]

lol ... I know, that is why I think you would get a blast out of getting and using a S950, S970, T5 or the Genos.

[Eric, B]

Hello Eric.

I just wanted to outline some reasons for not having bought a Genos.

Partly because I had to finance my son to go start a new life in Norway.
But also because I keep reading about so many bugs and problems that the Genos still has, especially the hanging and crashing.


As a live performer, it would be most embarrassing and traumatic to have an instrument freeze or crash in front of an audience.

I would never be able to trust, or feel comfortable with the instrument again,
if that were to happen to me.

And the prices are coming down Eric. As I said, I am patient.
I feel no urgency to acquire a Genos right away.

I suspect that even here, not all people are completely happy with their purchase, despite putting a brave face on it.

I will wait for the bugs to be fixed after they have been tested and pointed out.
And the downward trend of prices to continue.

Best Regards.
Pianoman.

Hi Pianomann,
The only time my Genos froze, was when I was doing a lot of programing. Only once.
Same with other small bugs.
It's not a deal breaker for me.
I have not had any issues just playing it.
But there will be an update real soon.
You know when you are ready. Financially and otherwise.
Best of luck to you.
Eric

[valimaties]

There are some things you have to think that might worth for an upgrade (not S970-S975, but Genos) . The 76 keys is one of the feature that has an importance of mine upgrade, also the touch screen. Playlist feature as well.
My Genos does not freeze at all till now, only a "crush error" indeed, but only one time changing the Registrations (yeah, indeed, is the main feature that has to be invincible ). But those errors or missing features could be solved by Yamaha in the next OS upgrade, so, it could be a choice for you!

[Lesh]

Seen photos and heard online demonstrations but Not actually been anywhere to see and hear the  Genos, but if I had the money  I could be tempted to buy one, boys and new toys for me and do like the larger keyboard.

Keep looking at the price to change but can't justify the price difference to part exchange my Tyros 5, AND NOT noticed any price reduction in the UK, YET.

I don't make any income from gigs or playing anywhere, I'm just a home player/learner which is another reason not to change.

And I still love the Tyros 5, it sound great, I'm use to all the menus and I'm still finding loads of new tricks it will do.

Les,

[Pianoman]

Thank you both Valimaties and Eric for the insights.

I have read that updates are coming for the Genos in the next few days or weeks.
I will continue following what Genos owners think of them, and if their issues will be solved by these updates.

The only way I will get to see a Genos in the flesh here would be to buy a plane ticket and fly to the mainland, since I live on an Island.

That would involve overnight stays in hotels as well as the plane ticket itself.
They won't bring a Genos here unless I pay up front.

I had hoped to go to the mainland in January for work purposes but that did not materialise.
It would have given me the opportunity to explore music stores there.

Anyway, I will follow closely the reactions of Genos owners over the next few weeks.

Best Regards.
Pianoman.

[Pianoman]

Hello Lesh.

The Tyros 5 must be a great instrument.
I assume this from the comments of T5 owners here and elsewhere.

I have read that the differences, apart from the drums, are not so significant.
Try out the Genos first.
It would be better if you could compare them side by side.

As for me, it's not so much about getting the latest.
It's to use as a work tool.

Buying an instrument with the same styles as my T3 means that
I'll basically have to play the same songs as last year
and the year before.

My focus is more on the styles than the new voices.
The voices on my T3 are just fine.

I had been looking at used T5s on websites here,
then suddenly I noticed a used Genos for sale.

A few days later, there was another one.
My instinct tells me that by June  or July,
I will see many more Genoses on the second hand market.

I could be wrong of course, but time will tell.
I am not in a hurry.

Best Regards.
Pianoman.

[Gandalf43]

I agree with you Pianoman !

The Genos is not a Genius ....unfortunately !

Cheers
Udo

[1-man-band-berlin]

Yamaha praised the Genos too much and caused some disappointment. In fact, the Genos is simply a Tyros 6 and that's not bad.

[Pianoman]

A member, who wrote a long and frank post, said something interesting about his Genos yesterday.

He said that if the Genos was called Tyros 6, and came in the same casing as the T5,
with the minor improvements in sound,
there would have been a different, and more honest reaction to the instrument,
regardless of Revo drums and such.

I can't find the post now, and have to rush out again,
but it was a very honest post by a Genos owner.

I think it was Kaarlo von Freymann, but I'm not sure though.

Best Regards.
Pianoman.

[Grayfox]

All the Tyros instruments looked very much the same and were better than the one before, Genos is very different and that is why it has a new name. It's appearance and the way it operates makes is very different from Tyros  and most people who own one say it's  an improved sound.

I have owned mine since early November and moving from T4 noticed a big difference.

I have never had a freeze, except for when I have not saved something, which is as it should be.

I have never experienced any bugs, but I guess it depends on what you are doing.

I think Pianoman you are trying to talk yourself out of buying Genos. If you are happy with T3 and it fills your needs then stick with it, perhaps you don't require a keyboard to be any better.

I for one like to keep up to date with the latest technology, and pleased I have.
Graham

[Gunnar Jonny]

Genos is simply Tyros 6 in disguise. I've seen some dealers do write 'The new Tyros 6' in sales adverts.
As is known, nice clothes cost money, a lot of money. Fashion and passion even more.
But it looks real great and sounds quite good too.
In my ears, the best sounding Yamaha arranger right out off the box so far. 

Regarding the Genos styles converted to other models.
I did try a lot at T4, but I can asure you, they don't sound as good as, not even close to, as when play at the real thing.

Before I did click the 'buy button', I had both PA4X-76 and Tyro..., sorry, I mean Genos as options.
Closed my eyes, and when open again, it was Genos that was in the order basket. 

[Lee Batchelor]

Used Genoses are slowly beginning to appear on second hand websites, being sold by those whose high expectations have not been met.,

I checked the eBay.ca website for used Genos keyboards. There aren't any. Of course, why would there be when there aren't any NEW Genos keyboards in Canada yet!!!! Yamaha - it's going on 5 months! What are we, dirt? Did Canada do something wrong? That is one reason alone for me to cancel my order. I can get my deposit back.

A more compelling reason is, I have never seen so much conflict and dissension about a new keyboard as the Genos. It can have all the best voices and Revo drums, but if the high number of problems are not solved, those things don't matter. As a gigging musician, I have used a lot of Yamaha keyboards. Out of the box, they were ready to play. The only problems I had were with functions I hadn't yet figured out. It sounds like the transition time from T5 to Genos is so great that I would need to keep my T5 for a month, assuming the new firmware update actually solves all reported issues.

As for this "miracle" firmware update, I do hope current Genos users aren't disappointed. What we call "bugs and missing functions," Yamaha may call "normal design." If Yamaha deals with only a few of the so-called bugs or missing functions, there's going to be a lot of unhappy people out there. Then, we may see a lot more used Genos keyboards.

[Pianoman]

Here are images of falling Genos prices.

[attachment deleted by admin]

[EileenL]

Don't be fooled as a lot of shops are no longer taking Part Exchange because they are full to the brim with Tyros 5 and 4. They therefore have reduced the price a little to compensate.

[Pianoman]

Eileen.
This is almost a 1000€ discount.

I know that you have to do what you have to do,
and I too am looking out for Number 1.

As a consumer, I don't really care what the motives of the seller are.
Whether his conscience bothered him, or if it his child's birthday.

It is not a small price adjustment. A 1000€ discount is 1000€,
whether one looks at it upright or sideways.

Ok, it is a 946€ discount, almost a Thousand.

I said this would happen, almost 3 months ago.
Those who wanted to believe did so, and those who did not, didn't.

These are prices for a brand new Genos.
I posted the old price of 6 weeks ago, and the actual price now.

I will buy when the price hits 3200€, which won't be long now.
That will be a 1300€ discount.

Best Regards.
Pianoman.

[attachment deleted by admin]

[Gandalf43]

As I am still looking for a smaller and lighter Keyboard version, but not the Genos!!
my dealer offered me brand new Tyros 5-61 direct from Yamaha !

2400,- EURO

I am thinking

Cheers
Udo

[Gunnar Jonny]

But is Tyros 5-61 a smaller and lighter version?
If check out the measurements and weight you may be surprised.

The real big difference are most likely the price level ..... if same as here, T5 price rised to cost about the same as Genos.

[Gandalf43]

Hi Gunnar ,
compared with my T5 - 76 

I want that smaller version for taking it with me in the back of my small car 

Cheers
Udo

[Gunnar Jonny]

Udo,
what you really need a wider car, or you can get my KMA for your T5. That will fit in whatever way you place it.

My mistake, I did not remember you have a T5. (Senior moment .... again) 

[Gandalf43]

No problem friend !

I am still not sure , I might even go for the PSR 970  (1400)
but I have to get the ok from my Irish Cat  :

Cheers
Udo

[zionip]

No problem friend !

I am still not sure , I might even go for the PSR 970  (1400)
but I have to get the ok from my Irish Cat  :

Cheers
Udo

Hi Udo,

A quick dimension comparison of your mentioned keyboards from Yamaha sites for your convenience:

	Tyros5-76	Tyros5-61	Genos	PSR-S970
Width (mm)	1347	1140	1234	1002
Height (mm)	142	142	138	148
Depth (mm)	450	450	456	437
Weight (kg)	16	14	13	11.6

Personally I love the 76 keys of the Genos, which makes left hand chording, and the split of Right3 voice a lot easier when compared to 61-key arrangers like the PSR-S970. 

Thanks,
Paul

[Gandalf43]

Hi Paul,

thank you very much, that is helpfull for a decission.
I will compare the technical details as well but I think to change from T5 to the 970
for a couple of weeks in the year should be ok.


cheers
udo

[Robert van Weersch]

I have to agree with Pianoman that the prices are dropping, at least here in the Netherlands. At introduction, the Genos would cost a whopping EUR 4500, but now it has dropped to EUR 3925 in some stores. Remarkably, no store can actually deliver it, because currently Yamaha has no Genos stock available.

[Pianoman]

I have been saying this for 3 months Robert.

One of the reasons that I came to this conclusion is that keyboard manufacturers
have followed the way of Smartphone companies.

To launch a new product every year or two, with teasers and all the
associated fanfare.

I know that the T5 was launched in 2015, but not everybody bought it in 2015.
Some for lack of immediate funds, others who took their time deciding,
while  others waited for bugs to be ironed out.

That means that there are many who bought their T5s in 2016 or even 2017,
and do not have the inclination or the funds to buy a new keyboard.

While many others just love their present keyboard,
and don't see the need to change every 2 years.

These things don't come cheap, and money doesn't grow on trees.

As a result, I suspect that sales volume is not as brisk as desired.

I predict that prices will fall even lower.

I hope that time will prove me right again.

Best Regards.
Pianoman.

[AlBags]

You pay your money and take your choice.
Everyone should realise there is always a premium to be paid to have a newly released
device 'hot off the press'

A better report on Genos should be made a few months down the road.

Al.