Does anyone know about the PSR E-473 Yet.

[Piano Tone]

Hoping to see the 473/425 released soon; I'm holding off on the purchase of a Korg EK-50 in hopes of full keyboard chord detection (so surprised that's not included on the existing models) and hopefully less menu deep diving for common settings like on the 373/310/463/410.   

[Keyboard Master]

Me Too. I have a feeling any day now.

[Piano Tone]

I wish I had checked this thread when the picture in question was up . . . I missed it lol

[Piano Tone]

Ok, Yamaha - times up.  My Korg EK-50 is on the way.  (I highly doubt that the 473/425 would have had full keyboard chord recognition as well as vastly reduced menu deep diving anyways . . . (of course this means it will be announced in days and will . . .

[Keyboard Master]

Agreed. And It/s November Now so Any day Yamaha should Launch them.

[SciNote]

I'm thinking that, since it is November and we still don't have the E473/EW425 yet, that we won't see them until the spring.  Usually, I remember new models coming out around October or earlier to sell in quantity in time for the Christmas season.

Piano Tone, let us know how your Korg is, especially in terms of sound creation and manipulation, such as filter, envelope generator, and DSP effects.  I know this is a Yamaha forum, but when Yamaha just jams the brakes for new product development in this category, won't give us any updates or details about the upcoming product, and gets bent out of shape about one photo floating on the Internet, then maybe it is time to start considering alternatives for the future.  I would prefer to stay with Yamaha, as they have produced great products.  But as my current keyboard is getting kind of old, I know I may need to replace it someday, and the existing line-up just doesn't excite me that much, unless I spend much more money for an EX600.

We understand that there is a lot going on right now, with the pandemic, shipping delays, and the fire at the microchip plant.  But this would be a great opportunity for Yamaha to support it's loyal customers by providing some information on the upcoming products -- because of these delays -- so that we can know what to do for the future.  Maybe this would cost Yamaha some lost sales in the current model line, but considering all of the other arrangers, synths, and pianos they make, not to mention all of the other types of musical instruments -- and let's not forget about the motorcycles and related products -- this would be a very small part of their overall revenue.

[Toril S]

When Korg keyboards can be on this forum, Yamaha mtorbikes can too😀😀😀🎹🏍🏍🏍🏍🏍🚔

[tbaroghel]

I did have a Korg EK-50 for a few weeks and returned it to Thomann in favor of my PSR.

I was very happy with the price, the keybed, the sounds, the effects, the amp  and the styles !

I was very disappointed though with style management (the lack of it, to be honest) as their USB stick method is completely medieval. You want to spend time playing, not managing files transfer.

Above all, the lack of a user community like this very forum was instrumental (I like this word given the context) in my decision.

As for a second keyboard (for the holiday/weekend house in Normandy), I will consider the 473 when it is out, but also the MEDELI AKX-10. Here is hoping both hit the market soon.

Thierry

[SciNote]

Yeah, I took a closer look at the online manual for that EK-50.  At first glance, it doesn't really look like it has much when you look at the control panel.  But there is a lot of good stuff there: the ability to layer 3 voices on the right side of the keyboard, roughly 150 different effects (and it appears to have the ability to layer two effects at once, independently on the right and left sides of a split keyboard), as well as hundreds of sounds and styles.

But there are some questions that either were not answered in the manual, or I just did not look deep enough to find those answers.  For example, you can layer 3 sounds on the right hand side, but can you adjust the volume of each sound independently?  And I saw where you can change the octave of the sound, but again, can the octave be set for each of the 3 layered sounds independently?  If not, then this is a serious shortcoming.  The keyboard does have some kind of recording function, but is it multi-tracking, like on the Yamaha E400 series keyboards (at least the E433 on up)?  On the Yamaha, we can record 5 independent tracks -- each containing 2 layered sounds (main and dual voice), along with a 6th accompaniment/rhythm track.  I am not sure about the recording capabilities of the EK-50, but my hunch, based on the online manual and specs I saw on Sweetwater.com, is that it can record 4 "melody" parts, and can include 8 accompaniment parts, which would likely be based on the style selected and not freely editable -- kind of like what our Yamahas record on the accompaniment track.  It is also not clear to me if the 4 melody tracks can each have up to 3 layered sounds, or if these tracks can be only one sound each.  I know on many of the Casios, they say they have a "17 track" sequencer, but only one of the tracks can include layered sounds, while all the rest can only be a single sound/voice.

There does seem to be some ability to modify the styles, and it may even be to possible load additional voices.

And there does appear to be 40 of what we call registrations (they call them "keyboard sets"), set up as 10 banks of 4, but it is not clear whether the rhythm/style can be "frozen" so that you can change the keyboard set during a song, to get a different sound, without changing the background rhythm or style at the same time.  And I saw no mention of any kind of synth functions, like filter, envelope generator, or portamento.

Please keep in mind that I have zero firsthand experience with this keyboard, and I got all of this info online, so if anyone who has had or does have this keyboard wants to correct me, certainly please do so.  This means, of course, that I also have no idea as to how good the key feel of the keyboard is.

I currently see this keyboard on Sweetwater.com for about $550 US, and there is a Korg EK-50L, which has more onboard amp/speaker power and additional sounds, for $100 more.  That's getting up there, and into the territory of something like, say, a gently used PSR-S670.  There seems to be a lot there, but at this point, not enough that would make me want to jump off the Yamaha ship.

Finally, again, I realize this is PSRTutorial, and not KORGTutorial, so I apologize if I'm stepping over the line.  But I do feel it is good to discuss what the competition offers, especially as we are all waiting for our updated models, so we can all make informed buying decisions, and perhaps also to discuss what features are important so that Yamaha can consider implementing them into their own future keyboards.

[Piano Tone]

Had my EK-50 for a few weeks and absolutely love it.  Has the best user interface I've ever seen on a keyboard or digital piano, and no menu deep diving whatsoever on an arranger keyboard (at least to me and in this price range) is unheard of.  Virtually everything you would ever need to do on the fly (add/remove layers, adjust relative layer volumes, mute/enable style parts, adjust relative part volumes, transpose +/-, octave shift +/-) is all quickly and easily available on the control panel.  I had a PSR E373 and the UI for that (in my opinion) was frustrating - you had to menu deep dive to do SO many common basic things (octave shift, adjust relative layer volumes etc). 

The USB drive will not only play wav but also mp3, and the filenames are visible on the display (which also has tons of useful info) - and you can easily adjust the incoming volume of a backing track on the fly which is super useful - I've had and have other boards where backing tracks from my iPad will distort when streamed in to a keyboard.  And the speakers are great, the piano patch is bright and clear and perfect for cutting through a mix.  I can't speak to using the USB for style transfers or anything like that (not my thing), but I love this keyboard.  Also has true full size keys (165mm octave width; almost all synth action boards say "full size" but are 159-160mm which many dont notice or care about, but being used to a digital piano with actual full size keys I definitely notice. 

I did a prelim review on my channel if you want to check it out:   https://youtu.be/X59R-PWCoDg

[vbdx66]

Hi to all,

A person who wishes to remain anonymous for disclosure issues but who I have reasons to believe is well-informed seems to think the E473 will hit the shelves sometime around next February. Nice, I also have my birthday at that time 

As long as the discussion goes off brand, I'd like to speak a bit about Casio here even though I am a hardcore Yamaha fan. I had a Casio CT-X3000 for a few weeks when it was released in 2018 and I just loved the sounds, the styles and the editing possibilities, including the DSPs. Eventually I sent it back because of its cumbersome user interface (to say the least). I then bought the CT-X800 which I still have. Much simpler to use but much less power and a disastrous keybed (the keybed of the 3000 was a joy to play, on par with that of pro synths).

Now they released the CT-S400, which is kind of their version of our PSR E373. Simple board, well designed, intuitive interface, same sound engine as the CT-X700/800, better keybed and some of the flaws corrected (such as this ridiculous issue of being unable to adjust the relative volume levels of the different voices on the CT-X800). The CT-S400 can now adjust volume levels, panning of all three voices, the arpeggiator can be assigned to any of the voices, you've got optional Bluetooth connectivity, etc. There is even a copy/paste function in the 6 tracks sequencer, which is completely unheard of in this price segment.

So while awaiting our beloved PSR E473, I also strongly hope that Casio will release a CT-S keyboard with the possibilities of the CT-X3000 but with the strengths and ease of use of the CT-S400.

As for those among you who are looking in the direction of Korg EK50/EK50L, go for the former. In an extensive video, Jeremy See explains how there isn't much difference between them really and the EK50 is much less expensive (see the link below).

Just my two cents,

Vinciane

https://youtu.be/GVHTGKDpigQ

[Toril S]

I have the Casio PRX-3000. The slimmest digital piano ever. And it has arranger functions and 200 styles and 700 voices. But it costs more than the Yamaha e series.

[vbdx66]

Hi Toril,

Do you mean the CT-X3000 by any chance? If yes, could you please report on your experience with it? What it misses in my opinion are the Live! Knobs of the PSR E series, as well as the possibility of the PSR E463 to record yourself on a thumbdrive. Very convenient to record a composition on the fly.

Regards,

Vinciane.

[Toril S]

No, this s PRx. The series s called Privia. 88 keys. 2 control knobs  and pb wheel. But it is really a digital piano with extra functions.

[vbdx66]

Oh it indeed looks cool 

[Toril S]

Corrected my typos😀 Yes it is cool and has good sound. I am suffering piano lessons. 😀

[vbdx66]

Hi Toril,

"Suffering piano lessons" I like that 
Have you had the chance to try the DGX670? How would you rate the Privia by comparison?

This doesn't tell us yet when the E473 will arrive 

Vinciane

[Toril S]

Yes, I have tried the DGX670. A very good instrument, better than the Privia because it is heavy and has fantastic speakers. But I fell for the Privia because it takes up little space and looks and sounds very good for its small size. For my needs it is perfect.

[SciNote]

Vinciane, I suspect that if you held on to your Casio CTX-3000, you would have found that the keyboard feel would have quickly degenerated.  I could be wrong, but I was in a music store, and they had a CTX-5000 on display, which is their $450 portable keyboard flagship.  The keyboard felt like a rickety $50 keyboard that had been dropped down the stairs!  You could say that this was because it was a display model that had been messed with by many people, but the same would be true for the Yamaha's on display, and none of the Yamaha's felt that degraded.  It is still true that the PSR-E463's key feel is not as good as the E433, and that is something that I hope is improved with the E473, but it's nothing like what I saw with that Casio.

I also did see a CTX-400, and I also felt it to be a decent keyboard for the price.  More logical menus, with push buttons that can change functions but are clearly labeled on the LCD display, 32 registrations, and even portamento built in to some of the synthesizer sounds.  But like you said -- more of a competitor to the Yamaha's PSR-E373, not the E463, as there are no live-control knobs and no user-editable effects other than reverb and chorus, as far as I could tell.  There may have been DSP -- I can't remember -- but there was no filter or envelope generator that I could find.  The key feel was okay (still not as good as Yamaha, in my opinion) -- so only time will tell if it holds up.

As for menu-diving on the E400 series, as compared to the Korg EK50, though I have no hands-on experience with the Korg, when I look at the pictures of its control panel, I really don't see what this is about.  Yes, I can see direct push-buttons to turn on and off the three right-hand parts and the split/left hand part, as well as the style parts, but I do not see any direct controls to change the volume or octave of these parts.  Direct buttons for overall octave and transposition are there, which is good.  But other than that, I don't see a major difference in regard to the Yamaha E400 series.  At least the E433 on up has direct buttons to turn on and off the dual and split voices, and there are direct buttons to turn on and off parts of an auto-accompaniment style.  And remember, for deeper editing of the sounds, all you have to do is hit and hold down a particular button for certain features, and then the keyboard automatically jumps to the correct part of the menu list of functions, reducing the need to scroll through dozens of parameters to find what you want.  Like if you want to change the dual voice octave, you just hit and hold down the dual voice button for a couple seconds, and then it is just a couple button presses from there to get to the dual voice octave function.  Admittedly, they don't have this explicitly available for the main voice, but you can either hold down dual voice button, then just step backwards through the functions to go into the main voice parameters, or use one of the other functions (it might be style volume, but I'm not sure), that is only a couple clicks away from the main voice parameters.

As for a possible February 2022 release date for the PSR-E473?  Sounds good and logical to me!

[vbdx66]

Hi Bob,

Here in France it is much too late and I am far too tired so I'll answer your long post when I'll be my normal self again.

Regards,

Vinciane

[Piano Tone]

As for menu-diving on the E400 series, as compared to the Korg EK50, though I have no hands-on experience with the Korg, when I look at the pictures of its control panel, I really don't see what this is about.  Yes, I can see direct push-buttons to turn on and off the three right-hand parts and the split/left hand part, as well as the style parts, but I do not see any direct controls to change the volume or octave of these parts.  Direct buttons for overall octave and transposition are there, which is good.  But other than that, I don't see a major difference in regard to the Yamaha E400 series.  At least the E433 on up has direct buttons to turn on and off the dual and split voices, and there are direct buttons to turn on and off parts of an auto-accompaniment style.  And remember, for deeper editing of the sounds, all you have to do is hit and hold down a particular button for certain features, and then the keyboard automatically jumps to the correct part of the menu list of functions, reducing the need to scroll through dozens of parameters to find what you want.  Like if you want to change the dual voice octave, you just hit and hold down the dual voice button for a couple seconds, and then it is just a couple button presses from there to get to the dual voice octave function.  Admittedly, they don't have this explicitly available for the main voice, but you can either hold down dual voice button, then just step backwards through the functions to go into the main voice parameters, or use one of the other functions (it might be style volume, but I'm not sure), that is only a couple clicks away from the main voice parameters.

Hi there!  The EK-50 user interface is amazing.  To change a relative voice volume layer, hold the button for the layer, spin the knob, the display will show your volume going up and down.  Same for a relative accompaniment part volume; hold the button spin the knob.  Same for a backing track relative volume; hold button, spin knob.  Same for BPM of metronome or rhythm; hold shift button, spin knob.   To octave shift a voice layer, hold the layer and hit the octave shift button. 

No menu deep diving at all, it's a brilliantly thought out interface.  As a matter of fact if you do go into the equivalent of the PSR series (massive) "function" menu, there are only a handful of entries, none of which are things you need often (specifying battery type etc).

Go to 9:09 in my review if you want to go straight to the user interface section.  https://youtu.be/X59R-PWCoDg 

[SciNote]

I agree that this sounds convenient, but still not truly direct, as holding down a button and then spinning the knob at the same time still requires you to use both hands at the same time.  And like I said, it's really not all that different than many of the PSR-E400-series functions, where you hold down a particular button to get to the function parameters related to that button, such as dual voice or split voice, then only have to tap the function-select button one or two times to get to the commonly used level and octave settings, then simply turn the knob (or use the plus and minus keys) to adjust the parameter.  Certainly, it's still not something you'd generally do during live playing, but it's not like you have to start from the beginning of a long list of functions and step through dozens of functions to get to what you want.

The EK-50 seems to be equivalent to the older PSR-530 to PSR-740 type keyboards, in that there are hundreds of (presumably) high quality sounds, and many effects that can be applied, but with no synthesizer type editing, such as filter or envelope generator.  I am curious, does the EK-50 have portamento, either as a selectable function or built in to some synthesizer sounds?

[casiokid]

I had an EK-50. Voices and adjustments were great. Lovely keybed. Choosing voices 'on the fly' meant using both hands. Downside was the loading of additional styles which have to be loaded in sets of six (Korg Set Lists). The on board Effects, apart from Reverb' I found were not much use and there was no 'panning.'

[Keyboard Master]

Agreed! i also Believe that the psr E473/ew425 could launch any day now even during the holidays. We might get Surprised.

[Keyboard Master]

Hello again everyone merry Christmas 🎄. Still don't see the psr e473 launched yet. Has anyone heard anything yet. I'm just curious.

[pjd]

Everything in musical instrument retail is on a slow schedule. The Winter NAMM show was postponed to June 3-5 in Anaheim, California, replacing the Summer NAMM usually held in Nashville.

A quick look at on-line retailers (mostly USA) shows Yamaha out-of-stock no matter what the category: digital pianos, arrangers or synths. Guitar Center locally (Seattle) claimed that arrangers, in particular, are hard to obtain. Even if Yamaha announced it, units wouldn't be available for months.

Having missed the holiday season, there's not much incentive for a new entry-level product.

-- pj

[pjd]

Well, Yamaha's competition is coming. Casio have been running a teaser for a new entry-level board of some sort. Four octaves and may have a vocoder. Uses the AiX LSI developed for the CT-Xx000 keyboards which compete with the Yamaha E-series.

A member of the Musicplayer Keyboard forum posted the pre-release image below.

Announcment date is simply January 2022.

All the best -- pj


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[SciNote]

Looks interesting, especially with those extra knobs.  But doesn't look too extensive -- certainly doesn't appear to have the capabilities of the Yamaha PSR-E400-series, but I know looks can sometimes be deceiving.  However, I'd really have to think about purchasing anything with just 4 octaves for how I would use such a keyboard.  I normally split the keyboard on my E433 and play both hands on that keyboard at once -- 4 octaves would really limit the range for that -- assuming that it can even split the keyboard, at all.  The vocoder is interesting, but not likely anything that I would use much, if at all.

Might make for a nice extra keyboard -- kind of like how I use my Roland Gaia synth with 3 octaves -- but might be kind of limited for a main keyboard.  But, we'll see!

[SciNote]

Did some digging and found this...

https://www.synthanatomy.com/2022/01/casio-ct-1000v-new-keyboard-with-vocal-synthesis-is-coming-soon.html

It looks like the "vocal" part isn't a vocoder, but instead some sort of vocal synthesis.  I'm guessing maybe a focus on various human voice and choir sounds.  Notice the big portamento knob!  The videos on the page are just teasers, but if they are indicative of the sound the keyboard can make, it might be interesting.  That webpage says it's supposed to be out sometime this month, but we all know about chip shortages and product delays these days.

[pjd]

Hi Bob --

Thanks. I agree that the CT-S1000V does not compete directly with the E-series. I wonder if this is Casio's answer to the VKB-100 Vocaloid keyboard?

https://sandsoftwaresound.net/yamaha-vkb-100-redux/

Casio appears to be running around playing Internet whack-a-mole with the images. Why are these people so controlling? It just hacks off influencers who might put a positive spin on their products.

All the best to ya -- pj


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