Genos 2

[groovyband.live]

Genos is essentially a Tyros 6, with a new user interface on top of it.

All the age old quircks are still there under the hoof

There is nothing build up from the ground with the Genos.
Its the same old wine just in a more luxurious bottle..

Absolutely!

One of the oldest marketing tricks is to change the name and packaging (and possibly the color and perfume) to make the same old product (i. e. a hand dish wash detergent) look as a brand new one (with miraculous cleaning abilities).

It is always surprising to see how many people still fall in the trap.....  Those probably did not even know and use more than 10% of their old Tyros they rushed to substitute with a Genos.

[soryt]

I hope that there wil be a better quality case and finish for the G2 , it may weight a little more but wil last longer
I dont like the surface now on the Genos , it becomes "shiney"there where you use often the buttons and sliders , and the overall build is realy cheap

S 

[Bachus]

I hope that there wil be a better quality case and finish for the G2 , it may weight a little more but wil last longer
I dont like the surface now on the Genos , it becomes "shiney"there where you use often the buttons and sliders , and the overall build is realy cheap

S 

Whats wrong with the case and finish of the current Genos..

High end plasticks, are so much stronger the metal..
They also are flexible, meaning they can bent back into its orriginal form..
Thinking metal is stronger is old school thinking

Metal casing these days is only for the looks..


The Genos is one of the most sturdy build keyboards around.. buttons, sliders, knobs all are of the highest quallity, as is the casing..

[Lee Batchelor]

Soryt is correct, Bachus and so are you. There's no need for metal cases anymore but the Genos does show shiny wear marks on frequently touched spots. I've tried everything to get them out. They're there for good and will lower my trade-in value down the road. The Tyros series never had this problem. Mine was pristine to the day I dealt it on the Genos.

And don't forget the numerous complaints about the numbers, letters, and other symbols that are wearing off button surfaces prematurely. In all ways, the Genos is by far Yamaha's best arranger but worst construction effort. My old PSR 2000 was built better. I suppose it's better to have a superior sound than appearance but we all know Yamaha has achieved both in all previous models. Profit has stood in the way of a superior finish for the Genos. The worst thing they could have done was chosen black - just ask anyone who drives a black car. Those cars show the tiniest blemish. A silver Genos would have looked amazing!

[vlbrgt]

Would the next keyboard not be a MIDI 2.0 ?
Roland already has a Midi 2.0 controller : A-88 MKII

[EileenL]

My Genos gets well used all over and is showing none of the above signs. I do keep it wiped down after every sessions and make sure my hands are not greasy. I also look at others playing there keyboards on you tube etc. and all those still look good with sign no worn letters or shiny marks.

[Toril S]

A silver finish would look fantastic!

[Joe H]

Would the next keyboard not be a MIDI 2.0 ?
Roland already has a Midi 2.0 controller : A-88 MKII

I suspect you are right.  MIDI v2.0 is backward compatible, but allows for great expansion... more channels, higher resolution, etc.

Joe H

[Lee Batchelor]

My Genos gets well used all over and is showing none of the above signs. I do keep it wiped down after every sessions and make sure my hands are not greasy. I also look at others playing there keyboards on you tube etc. and all those still look good with sign no worn letters or shiny marks.

You just made my point, Eileen. All my T5 ever needed was a light dusting from time to time. The Genos needs to be babied after every use because Yamaha cheaped out on the finish. I don't mind cleaning it once in a while as long as the marks come off. I treat my Genos like a baby kitten and yet it retains every little mark.

[t4inbax]

Hi, I like my Genos much, but... it needs improving in my opinion in the following ways:

- All manuals printed out to come with the keyboard. Genos is a very expensive keyboard, and to have to print out the extra manual on line is el-cheapo in my opinion. And it should be expanded with more examples.

- There should be an extensive on keyboard "Help" button, that explains in greater detail how to use all the features, with examples. (Like Yamaha use to have)  And the "Help section" should be continuously updated to explain new features and or changes. I get very frustrated going to the manuals to find out how to do something, and some of the explanations are either missing, or poorly written, or simply confusing!

- The touch screen is great, but larger to have more choices, and easier to read.

- Someone suggested 'backwards compatibility'. That's a "much needed' for me! I have so many registrations, styles, etc., from my T4 and when I bring them to Genos, they do not work right. I have tried using the Manager, but tedious and difficult to use. (Maybe you all can help me be more successful with it!)

That's all I can think of right now...

[Genos!]

I have two keyboards in silver and two in black.

I do like the black, but you can see every little nuance.

[Lee Batchelor]

I have two keyboards in silver and two in black.
I do like the black, but you can see every little nuance.

I had a friend who ran a car detailing business. After he had detailed black cars, customers were notorious for complaining if they saw one lint fibre on the outside. He quickly adopted the adage, "People who buy black cars, shouldn't!!" Yamaha should heed this advice.

[Fred Smith]

- Someone suggested 'backwards compatibility'. That's a "much needed' for me! I have so many registrations, styles, etc., from my T4 and when I bring them to Genos, they do not work right. I have tried using the Manager, but tedious and difficult to use. (Maybe you all can help me be more successful with it!)

The Genos is backwards compatible with recent keyboards, including the T4.

When I upgraded from my T4 to Genos, I simply copied over all of my registrations, and every one worked. I had them all running within 15 minutes of turning on the Genos.

It's true that some of them need to be tweaked, as the Genos doesn't always choose the right substitution, but I can work at that at my leisure.

Cheers,
Fred

[EileenL]

Speaking of the colour Black when you order a new car if you want it in black it always costs more.
  I used to have tecnics keyboards and they would go shiny very quickly around the volume knobs and anything you used a lot. I have had my Genos for two years and nothing has started to shine as yet so I am very pleased with mine.

[Al Ram]

In a way is good to see people complaining about the black color of Genos .. . . . if they complain about the color it means that the functionality and sound is great . . . otherwise, people would be complaining about stuff not working and the color would be the least of problems.

Thanks

[J. Larry]

Color is not a major issue with me, although I prefer darker finishes.  I always keep my arranger covered when not in use.  The point someone made about the need for better manuals-----I'd rather have detailed instructional videos instead.  For example, I couldn't get the hang of creating multiple registration banks, even after reading about it.  I watched one Mike Mixon video and learned it immediately.  Much quicker and more efficient than wading through print pages.

[soundphase]

Genos is essentially a Tyros 6, with a new user interface on top of it.

As much as an old Pentium 4 or Core 2 Duo CPU with Microsoft Windows 95 is for a coreI7+GeForce GTX xxxx card with Windows 10.

Generally I agree with Bachus, but not here.

We only talk about samples with algorithms. We only talk about real-time RAM access and RAM capacity + algorithms complexity.
For this kind of electronic device, quite all is hard-coded into micro-processors. Genos/Tyros are not a PC with VST instruments ...

So, I think SWP70 and new 32-bits audio converters usage (+ new DSP effects) are a true evolution over Tyros 5 engine. A new commercial series of arrangers began ...

[soryt]

On the 900 SX there is a brushed alluminium black plate on the surface , why not on the Genos or in the aftermarket ?

Soryt

[Lee Batchelor]

On the 900 SX there is a brushed aluminum black plate on the surface, why not on the Genos or in the aftermarket?

Perhaps Yamaha learned from the error of their ways.

[Joe H]

... To overcome the legacy problems, you need to start new from scratch.. and offer legacy support as a seperate service...  with the current touch screen interfaces this would very well be possible..

Be careful what youe wish for... you just might get it!

Have you looked at the MIDI v2.0 specifications?

MIDI 1.0 is enhanced where possible and MIDI 2.0 devices offer a lot more capability with 2-way communication via USB and higher resolution, etc while maintaining backward compatibility with MIDI 1.0.


MIDI 2.0 Review
https://www.sweetwater.com/insync/midi-2-0-what-actually-matters-for-musicians/


MIDI 2.0 Specs
https://www.midi.org/midi-articles/details-about-midi-2-0-midi-ci-profiles-and-property-exchange

There a few videos to watch with the second link.

Joe H

[Toril S]

We go for titanium😀😀😀

[Bachus]

Would the next keyboard not be a MIDI 2.0 ?
Roland already has a Midi 2.0 controller : A-88 MKII

We have to see, so far midi 2.0 seems to be a Roland only show..

[Bachus]

My Genos gets well used all over and is showing none of the above signs. I do keep it wiped down after every sessions and make sure my hands are not greasy. I also look at others playing there keyboards on you tube etc. and all those still look good with sign no worn letters or shiny marks.

I agree with you.. no marks or wear on my Genos
And i am much less cautious then you are.

[musicman01]

Genos is the best entertainer keyboard ever made, but I have to assist "Soryt" on certain points.
The top layer and the switches are very fragile, and it would be interesting to make them in brushed aluminum.
And something that has always bothered me are the "knik-Knak" switches since the Tyros line,
these can certainly be a bit more solid and softer, such as with Wersi, Nord Electro & Stage.

[Joe H]

We have to see, so far midi 2.0 seems to be a Roland only show..

There are videos that show Yamaha keyboards talking to each other.  And there is a possibility that Yamaha can upgrade some of their gear to the MIDI 2.0 features... but I think we can expect the next generation of Yamaha synthesizers and arrangers will be MIDI 2.0 compliant. So a lot of what people have been asking for will be possible with 2.0.

Joe H

[groovyband.live]

There are videos that show Yamaha keyboards talking to each other.  And there is a possibility that Yamaha can upgrade some of their gear to the MIDI 2.0 features... but I think we can expect the next generation of Yamaha synthesizers and arrangers will be MIDI 2.0 compliant. So a lot of what pi have been asking for will be possible with 2.0.

Joe H

Nearly 40 years after the original MIDI 1.0 spec, Yamaha is still far from implementing 14 bit of resolution for the pitch bend (as allowed since 1983). Top of the line Montage synth does not even implement basic midi commands found in toys (even those made by Yamaha themselves!). And the USB link tops out at 30 kbytes/s (ridiculously low speed, and many users complain that when with a DAW they send many bank/program change one after another, the Montage will simply ignore them).

So, they might also implement MIDI 2.0 (by repackaging the bits into the new format), but probably with features not even aligned with MIDI 1.0. In fact, as the low resolution pitch bend wheel example teaches us, high res (> 127 values) transducers cost money, more money than Yamaha is willing to spend even in their top of the line instruments (the Genos does not even have encoders, but only cheaper potentiometers).

And by the way, already MIDI 1.0 allows 14 bit resolution CCs (by using 2 of them in tandem). Of course Yamaha never used this feature since their transducers are low resolution, and sometimes do not even have 127 discreet steps.

[Joe H]

Nearly 40 years after the original MIDI 1.0 spec, Yamaha is still far from implementing 14 bit of resolution for the pitch bend...

... And by the way, already MIDI 1.0 allows 14 bit resolution CCs (by using 2 of them in tandem). Of course Yamaha never used this feature since their transducers are low resolution, and sometimes do not even have 127 discreet steps.

I never have heard the so called "zipper noise" associated with Yamaha's 14-bit Pitch Bend in the 30 + years I've played Yamaha keyboards.  I guess Yamaha thinks 256 steps is enough.  As far as the NRPNs go; (which Yamaha uses a lot of) there is very little practical use for 14-bit resolution (16,384 steps) for applications that Yamaha use them for.  The only (possible) true 14-bit resolution is with the Bank Select message.

So what is your point... besides wining and complaining about Yamaha?



Joe H

[EileenL]

Yes Joe that seems to be all GB can do and that is to run Yamaha down. Gets very annoying after a while.

[groovyband.live]

So what your point... besides wining and complaining about Yamaha?

YOU said that Yamaha might upgrade their old gear to Midi 2.0.
I showed you that they, in nearly 40 years, did not even use Midi 1.0 to its full extent.

This is not complaining, this is a fact. On the other hand yours is wishful thinking.

Nothing wrong with it. But, using your words, what is the point?

[groovyband.live]

I never have heard the so called "zipper noise" associated with Yamaha's 14-bit Pitch Bend in the 30 + years I've played Yamaha keyboards.

Check the official Yamaha Montage forum. Even Yamaha recognized publicly the problem.