New recordings (made on Genos) that I did recently

[JohnS (Ugawoga)]

Hi Pino
I am not a lego builder as i play a song then just do minor edits. I do not want to sound like a midi file.
YES YOU ARE DEAD RIGHT
I am one brick short of a building set!! Rather av a legover!! & a bottle of wine!!
The thing is that i get all main parts of a song on track 1 with registration changes.
What i do is convert to wave and chop the top line and put into different tracks for EQ.
Thanks to another on this forum telling us that it is best to disolve your drum tracks and then you have control over each drum kit element.
Great tip.
I also notice that in the Genos sounds there is quite a bit of resonance in some sounds which are not pleasant until you EQ them out.
Ozone does put you in the ballpark  and is a worthwhile investment
I have nearly completed my first big task and i now have a better understanding of how sound works and how things can mask other things that give you boxiness or mud in the final stages. Also learning to control bass is a learn curve. Learning frequencies is another plus in your arsenal.
I still have a way to go, but that is the fun.
I also agree with Mikf.

[JohnS (Ugawoga)]

Hi Eileen
You can do what you like and i also do not care about what is or is not. It is good to swap ideas and talk.
A guitarist, sax player or a piano player can only play one instrument at a time . A keyboard player has to be multi-tasking.
we are like Don Partridge " Rosie woh Rosie!!! remember that!!
If you are in a band you play bits and pieces an have humans to keep the beat with
A Genos player has to keep time to a machine!!. The band inside is relentless!!! The robot orchestra takes no Prisoners!! No6
I am not a number ," I am a Free Man"!!!

All the best
john              "The trouble is the Humans"!!

[Pino]

Jim, very nicely played, I know how much time it takes to get thing to where we're happy, I've multi-recorded loads of songs over the years,

My question was, what do we do after we record a few extra tracks on top of our pre-recorded style based song turning it into a midi file, do we then play a melody line over the midi file when performing to an audience or do we go back to playing the style as in style play.?

I suppose that we have to play the best music we have available, whether it's a home made midi or a style and that is where the problem is within my head, I don't feel good playing midies.

It would be great if YAMAHA could add a 'piano roll editor' screen to our arrangers, then wouldn't need to go near a PC for making music.

The best arranger keyboard I've owned to date is the Technics, they had brilliant tools for on-board editing including a wide screen and a 'piano roll' editor

I recorded these songs (Christmas CD-1995) using the Technics KN7 styles, arranged and edited all the songs solely on the KN7 'piano roll editor'.     
Still doesn't sound too shabby even 25 years on.

Pino

https://app.box.com/s/hjlu5fsntlbnbydjv59qqbwtm0eipowd

https://app.box.com/s/uwy6gcasf7o2rfib0oztcby37ww2c350

https://app.box.com/s/h4z4wlhpfz1bq0ivpbbxkv8lp2bo7tet

https://app.box.com/s/gqsw1l699vlvkpvkxyr2u15kv5wv0ukp

https://app.box.com/s/wt22dkr8gmdlv300pvydtb9x0cfc9uvn

[JohnS (Ugawoga)]

Hi Pino

Make a song the best you can and then you have a master track to save and listen to on a stereo hi-fi and put on some sites.
With Cubase you can get your song in the ballpark for sound levels as Soundcloud, box etc have a standard and sometimes you are left wondering why your track is too soft and not as you perceived it -14 to 15 LUFs , not the -3 db standard.
The -14 Luf's is a better perceived volume standard as -3 db the old way can be too soft if the wave peaks are not compressed and the spiders body fattened a bit..
I am learning all the time and i am no where near a pro yet!!

During all tht process it helps to sort out the registrations so you can play live to it.
For me it has been a big learn curve ,but EQ and all of that stuff  is better understood and you can apply that the best you can to the Genos.
Balancing and tweaking gets a better sound on the Genos.
I do find that it is best to sort a styles bass and kick drum/snare etc out before recording.

All the best
john

[JohnS (Ugawoga)]

Hi Franco Massa
Hey Frank " do you drive racing cars"!!  Silly me  "It must be Fillipi

I have now got used to the tonal balancing in Neutron
Great for practicing EQ
Just got to check my song tomorrow as my ears ar shot. It is weird how your perception of a song changes even after  long periods at a low volume.
So Balancing to start and then mix to your hearts content and check with tonal balance.
I am Doing Mr Blue Sky and the getting a choir just right is quite hard on the Genos. I married a choir with men from Sampletank 4 and the blend with the female voices on Genos works a treat.
Ihave also done the Dramatic ending to the song  and for me that was the easy part .
Oh well having fun learning.
I have  yet have to finish it all in Ozone, but i have conquered the Neutron. I had a Quantum Leap with a glass of whisky to celebrate.
If you want to chat on this more we could open up a new thread.


All the Best
john

[Pino]

John, We're on the opposite end of the music spectrum.

I'm into playing and your into producing
There's member here that are players and members that are sound engineers and producers and everything in-between and it's all good.

With new apps and music programs coming out every week then players would be distracted to spend time on the technical side but I can tell you, if you want to go out gigging then P is for 'Practice' rather than Programming on the PC.

I would think your reward is when you mastered a great mix,
My reward is when the dance floor is full and that's a good feeling. getting out there is a lot of fun

I've put some songs up here using the on-board styles, all ready to go in minutes and recorded on the SX, if you were down at a beer garden or a chill-out bar after a hard days work and sipping a drink or two in the evening sun you would be happy to listen to a keyboard player turning out these songs and I can tell you that the sound coming out from my 2 Eon One's would be 100 times better than from iPad or PC speaker sound on this MP3 recording.

Have fun John 😀
Look forward to hearing 'Mr Blue Sky'.

Pino

https://app.box.com/s/hg9qi6mu53n4uh6e4lux47b6msm3ul4p

[Lee Batchelor]

My reward is when the dance floor is full and that's a good feeling. getting out there is a lot of fun

Fully agreed but sadly, where I live in Canada, those gigs are likely banned for a long time until we get a vaccine for Covid-19. I'd say that's going to be at least 2 more years. The vaccine is at least 18 months away, and then it needs to be administered to the masses. Live entertainment everywhere is completely off the table and will likely be the last thing to be reinstated unless the leader where you live is a complete moron and doesn't care how many people die.

I'm glad to have recording to fall back on . Believe me, recording tracks IS practice because you don't want to spend hours cleaning up mistakes. Whether you're playing the Genos for a dancing crowd or a track in a DAW, you want to get it right the first time.

[mikf]

Hi Lee - tough world for live gig musicians just now, but it will come back. We had live music at our golf club on a Friday, seemed a bit soon to me, but I guess people after a while just accept there is risk and get on with life.  Normality returns.
Mike

[Lee Batchelor]

Agreed, Mike. Are you in the US? Seems the US is moving faster on the re-opening than a lot of countries except for those that have basically had no cases for several weeks.

Let's hope we can get out playing again soon ! It has one enormous benefit over recording at home - it keeps you sharp.

[mikf]

Yes I am in the US right now although I also have a home in Scotland. We should be there right now escaping this Texas summer heat, but Covid has kept us here.  The area in Texas where we live has had very little virus issue, and in the last week things have become pretty relaxed. In fact locally life is almost back to normal, malls, restaurants, shops all opening again. Not sure yet if that is good or bad!
I long since stopped gigging but agree it keeps your playing really sharp. I did a little sit in with a friend who is a terrific vocalist last year at his gig in an upmarket restaurant just outside Toronto (my daughter lives there). I played Ok and enjoyed it. But like riding a bike, after a 25 year break you might not fall off but you wouldn't enter the Tour de France.
Mike

[Lee Batchelor]

Mike, I live east of Toronto by about 75 miles. Our small community is close to a major city. The entire catchment area is about 250,000 people and yet, we've only had about 120 cases, no deaths, all resolved, and only a small amount in ICU. Despite our low numbers, we're still under the Toronto area rules, which means our beaches, restaurants, and other public events are still either closed or under very tight restrictions.

Personally, I don't see us going into seniors' residences ever again. They have been my bread and butter for the past 15 years. There's no way I'm going back to the scummy bars to play in a loud band until 2:00 a.m. for peanuts.

In Canada, I believe 75% of our deaths have been in long-term facilities and they are under a very strong magnifying glass at the moment because their infection control protocols have failed miserably. On the other hand, I don't see why we can't hold outdoor concerts for people who are willing to social distance - although the nice weather has given people a false sense of security as they attend anything outdoors while being in close proximity to one another!

[jimlaing]

Thanks Piano for those nice KN-7000 recordings!  That was my 'instrument of choice' some years ago, the Technics KN-5000 then 7000.  Too bad they stopped making keyboards! 

Re: playing vs. recording ... yeah, we cover the spectrum - some people like primary to play live, some like the recording/mixing and putting songs together that way.  I guess I'm closer to the "play songs live" preference, as I like to do my live performances, and when it comes to recording, I mostly just record a 'live-played' audio track, then maybe do a small amount of 'engineering' as I did in these 26 songs here (in this thread).  I tend to not prefer to spend a ton of time in the 'studio' side of it; most of the time is playing the song and recording that in one go, then maybe 'sweetening' it a little if I want to make a recording to hand out to friends and family.  When I do the live playing, I just play using the styles and sounds on the Genos.  Both 'sides' of this can be rewarding ... just depends on a person's preference, what they enjoy most, etc. - and perhaps on what their 'goal' is in creating/playing/recording songs.

Nice that we have a variety of ideas and possibilities!

-Jim

[Lee Batchelor]

Fully agreed, Jim.

The wonderful thing is, whether you're a live player or studio "make it perfect" player, we're all increasing our life span on this planet, and helping to stem off Altheimer's and dementia. At least that's what I read from reliable medical sources.

[JohnS (Ugawoga)]

Hi jim
That is what i do ,play a song a few times live and do the mnior edits in Cubase.
I just chop the track 1 into several parts and put on separate tracks and disolve the drum parts to mix separately That's it.
This way you can change registrations and play , so you don't sound like a midi file.
The beauty of this is that you can sdd vst Instruments and maybe put an extra track in to embelish.

All the best
John

[mikf]

John
You keep making this statement about not sounding like a midi. I would really like to know what you mean because to me if whether you record something on midi or on audio it always comes back how you played it. ie if you play it good it comes back good, if you play it bad it comes back bad. How can it change depending on the recording medium?
Mike

[Lee Batchelor]

John probably means that he doesn't over-use things like quantization, rigid velocity curves, and other settings that take the human feel away from an original recording.

[Pino]

John, We're on the opposite end of the music spectrum.

I'm into playing and your into producing
There's member here that are players and members that are sound engineers and producers and everything in-between and it's all good.

https://app.box.com/s/hg9qi6mu53n4uh6e4lux47b6msm3ul4p

John, apologies if it came over as If I was saying that you are not a player,  of-course you are a player and probably a good one at that,  what I meant was that I play the styles more or less as is, maybe tweaking a little where I think you are more refined, making sure that every voice sounds it's best, wish my English was better sometimes. 😀

Pino

[JohnS (Ugawoga)]

Hi Pino
Do not worry as it is good to have banter.
LIve playing is good and also delving into the Abyss is also good hopefully not coming up with egg on your face!!
I have finished mixing my first song with Ozone  and got a nice  Tonal  balance curve.
Now to mixdown to single wave to master in Ozone
I am wondering after all that i have learnt whether the end result will be any good. That is the frightener.
I have got to now master the matching to a reference track  and then done.
I want to get decent results because it is nice to have a collection of your own music sounding  good.
I  will use the two mixes , one for streaming and one for cd. So that has to be learnt
Last night i spent two hours practicing for a rest as all this learning does your ears in and i  tend to lose sound focus.
Tomorrow i will check on monitors and the bounce down to single track.
Once I get used to this it will be a walk in the park HOPE!!!!
All takes time and at the moment we have plenty of Covid time!!
Your songs also sound very good, nice medley.


All the Best
John

[Pino]

John, I decided to plonk on a "thank you" because you are a big contributor to this forum. I'm sure 1,000 have red your posts around the world over the years but not often do you get any thanks, and I will say, always humorous and funny 😄

Pino

[jimlaing]

Thanks . . . appreciate the comments!
-Jim

[manuel]

Hi Jim

Very nice recordings !!, I know some replies got into another subject, but, that aside, Keep them coming, you are very versatil too....I like that.

How do you process your recordings?, I use only the recorder on the Genos, sometimes I do the MIDI first, then I record it into audio....and I take it out into my computer and convert it into MP3 Using Sound Forge or Audacity.....
And 99% is just play and record....I know how to add tracks, but, I dont do it. I use Multipads to add something, but that is in real time as I am playing.

I think you mention a program, is that to Finalize the audio or what?? Just curious.

Manuel Dorantes

[jimlaing]

Hi - thanks for the comments on my recordings - I do most of the work right in the Genos- making a complete recording in one pass of me playing the song.  I save that to a WAV file via the Genos' recording capability.  I take the WAV file and open it in Pro Tools, which is the audio/recording program that I have used for many years.  For some songs, I play the Genos into an audio interface, with Pro Tools, and add a little bit 'extra' (such as a layer of strings, a horn line, a glockenspiel on one verse, etc.) - just a little like that; I do not use multi-tracking extensively, just a little to add a sound on top of the original 'live played' recording.

I don't do much other processing, but I do use a tool called Isotrope to do a final 'mastering' of the track - mainly so that the overall sound level is similar from song to song; this tool help me even out the overall volume of all songs for consistency to make it like an 'album'.

Jim