Yamaha Pollicy for trading accounts..

Bachus · January 07, 2019, 12:06:02 PM

If i buy a Genos with premium packs on it..
What is the pollicy of Yamaha where it comes to selling the account with the keyboard?

EileenL · January 07, 2019, 12:20:30 PM

I have never heard of this being done. If someone wishes to leave there Yamaha packs in the keyboard that's fine but unless they actually give you the packs so that you can load into the YEM they are useless to you because when you load in anything else the keyboard will be formatted and the voices lost.
Yamaha protect there Genos packs so that they can not be shared. If I were you I would not pay for any packs left in but Start your own account with Yamaha and purchase from new.

Roland · January 07, 2019, 12:45:28 PM

Hello Bachus,

Eileen is right ! I have seen so many "Keyboard for sale including premium packs worth LOTS..." type of advertisements which is ridiculous :-) DON'T fall for that !!

If you buy a used Genos or Tyros 5, you're basically buying the instrument with its original factory content.

The only time I have seen keyboard sales WITH Premium packs is if a dealer offers the keys together with vouchers for Packs.

Cheers, Roland

Bachus · January 07, 2019, 01:08:49 PM

Quote from: Roland on January 07, 2019, 12:45:28 PM
Hello Bachus,

Eileen is right ! I have seen so many "Keyboard for sale including premium packs worth LOTS..." type of advertisements which is ridiculous :-) DON'T fall for that !!

If you buy a used Genos or Tyros 5, you're basically buying the instrument with its original factory content.

The only time I have seen keyboard sales WITH Premium packs is if a dealer offers the keys together with vouchers for Packs.

Cheers, Roland

I think this is against dutch law..
You are allowed to sell everything you buy in Holland..
And Yamaha or any other company needs to make that possible..

The only thing Yamaha is allowed to do,
is charge a reasonable fee,
if they need to make some administrative actions..

I don't think, its just ditch law, but european customer protection law..

Roland · January 07, 2019, 01:13:25 PM

When you buy items from the Yamaha Musicsoft store, you are agreeing to accept their policies. And their governing law is the State of California. You can read more about that here https://www.yamahamusicsoft.com/customer-agreement

Bachus · January 07, 2019, 01:18:45 PM

Quote from: Roland on January 07, 2019, 01:13:25 PM
When you buy items from the Yamaha Musicsoft store, you are agreeing to accept their policies. And their governing law is the State of California. You can read more about that here https://www.yamahamusicsoft.com/customer-agreement

Yamaha can say lots of things..

When they sell stuff in Holland, even over the internet, they have to abide dutch laws..
Thats what ditch law says... and if their policies conflict with dutch law(or any other european country) they dont count in the Netherlands..

Now companies mostly come away with this, as taking things to court is very very expensive ..

Gunnar Jonny · January 07, 2019, 01:39:52 PM

Why not ask the seller for the downloaded packfiles and store backup at your PC (If buy Genos)?
I've all pakcs both downloaded at the PC as well as redownløoadable at the store.
The downloaded packs should still work to backup and transfer by use of YEM, because the instrument ID will not change because of new owner.

Anyway, I think Yamaha support will help you if nessesary. They have always been very nice and replied very quick to me regarding any softwareissues.

Bachus · January 07, 2019, 01:51:42 PM

Quote from: Gunnar Jonny on January 07, 2019, 01:39:52 PM
Why not ask the seller for the downloaded packfiles and store backup at your PC (If buy Genos)?
I've all pakcs both downloaded at the PC as well as redownløoadable at the store.
The downloaded packs should still work to backup and transfer by use of YEM, because the instrument ID will not change because of new owner.

Anyway, I think Yamaha support will help you if nessesary. They have always been very nice and replied very quick to me regarding any softwareissues.

This sounds prommissing....
But for the redownloadable part at the store, i guess i need access to his account..
It could be as easy as changing email adres on the account?

Sadly i don't have experience with yamaha's software protection and accounts..
Now i am a big fan of companies trying to protect their software from hackers, we all need to pay for what we buy, everything else is thievery..

So far i have never run into problems when buying used software/licenses... companies allways where willing to help, espescially where that software relied on hardware..

MarkF_48 · January 07, 2019, 02:14:51 PM

Will Yamaha do a transfer of the original owners 'license/registration' to a new owner? This is how Adobe does it or used to do when I sold an Adobe Photoshop software package to another person. I had to contact Adobe and 'unregister' the serial number of the software from my ownership. This enabled me to sell the software and allow the buyer to be able register it himself.

Bachus · January 07, 2019, 02:24:47 PM

Quote from: MarkF_48 on January 07, 2019, 02:14:51 PM
Will Yamaha do a transfer of the original owners 'license/registration' to a new owner? This is how Adobe does it or used to do when I sold an Adobe Photoshop software package to another person. I had to contact Adobe and 'unregister' the serial number of the software from my ownership. This enabled me to sell the software and allow the buyer to be able register it himself.

Same procedure i used several times for example for NI komplete and Ableton live

Gunnar Jonny · January 07, 2019, 02:26:49 PM

Quote from: Bachus on January 07, 2019, 01:51:42 PM
.....
But for the redownloadable part at the store, i guess i need access to his account..
It could be as easy as changing email adres on the account? ...

Not nessesarely, the seller can download, or redownload from his account page (if not already done so) and copy to a CD or other media for you.

(Btw, If the seller has no other purpose with his account than the Genos use, I would have asked Yamaha Support if it's possible to transfer the files to your excisting or new created account.)

DerekA · January 08, 2019, 07:47:40 AM

I think that when YEM creates an install file for a protected pack, it performs a check against the registered Musicsoft account.

So I think it's true to say that if you are given a pre-prepared install file containing the pack, that was generated for the specific instrument, you should be able to load it up again at a later date. But you may not be able to take the 'raw' pack file and export a new install file from YEM that mixes the pack with anything else.

valimaties · January 08, 2019, 09:23:47 AM

When you install a pack in YEM downloaded from YMS account, you will be asked for your account information: email and password. If email and password does not fit to your's content pack, the content will not be installed. The pack was paid by previews owner, in its account. You will not be able to download freely that pack (or packs) from your account, even if you registered the same keyboard in your account. I can register a lot of Genos, for example, in my account, if I sell a pack as cpi or cpf (which means I have info file from each user's Genos).
The only solution is like this:
Seller: request Yamaha to delete packs from its account and to transfer to new email address. In the same time, seller has to prove the sale process of its keyboard. Or Yamaha must have a "block" list for keyboard ids, and seller has to unregister its keyboard, and buyer to register the keyboard in its account.

In this condition, the new owner of Genos can download anytime the pack(s) from its account and can install to its YEM installation without any problem.

Regards,
Vali

DerekA · January 08, 2019, 06:04:57 PM

Quote from: valimaties on January 08, 2019, 09:23:47 AM
The only solution is like this:
Seller: request Yamaha to delete packs from its account and to transfer to new email address. In the same time, seller has to prove the sale process of its keyboard. Or Yamaha must have a "block" list for keyboard ids, and seller has to unregister its keyboard, and buyer to register the keyboard in its account.

Vali, I am not sure if you are saying this is what you would *like* Yamaha to do, or if this is what actually happens today. How do you 'prove the sale' ?

Joe H · January 08, 2019, 08:43:40 PM

Isn't it possible for the seller to remove the Genos from his account so Bachus can register the instrument in his own account. Then ask Yamaha if the packs are transferable to the new owner (Bachus) so he can load them in YEM and install them as he likes with other (future) packs.

Joe H

valimaties · January 09, 2019, 03:50:14 AM

Quote from: DerekA on January 08, 2019, 06:04:57 PM
Vali, I am not sure if you are saying this is what you would *like* Yamaha to do, or if this is what actually happens today. How do you 'prove the sale' ?

In my country (i don't know others, but I think is the same) there are notary which will accredit the process between seller and buyer, for natural persons.
But I don't think this is very important. An open ticket to Yamaha, start by seller, which will ask them to move some content from its account to buyer's account, I think is enough.

Regards,
Vali

valimaties · January 09, 2019, 04:10:45 AM

Question:

What happening if your YEM has a bought pack, you sell your keyboard, install a new keyboard? Can you install your pack to new keyboard?! I did not tried... But I think nothing happening, so you can use your all YEM content to new keyboard.

EileenL · January 09, 2019, 07:52:11 AM

I think you would have to register your new keyboard and then import the new keyboards ID which will contain all the information needed by Yamaha to verify you own the packs you want to load.

DerekA · January 09, 2019, 08:53:00 AM

Quote from: EileenL on January 09, 2019, 07:52:11 AM
I think you would have to register your new keyboard and then import the new keyboards ID which will contain all the information needed by Yamaha to verify you own the packs you want to load.

Yes, that's what I did to be able to load packs I purchased for the S770 onto my T5. Same user account so no issues.

valimaties · January 10, 2019, 03:29:33 AM

This is not about packs you already bought for older models...

It is known that those packs (one of them being upgraded) can be downloaded freely.

Here is about packs which someone bought for him in his account, and wants to sell its keyboard and transferring those packs to new user.

Quote from: EileenL on January 09, 2019, 07:52:11 AM
I think you would have to register your new keyboard and then import the new keyboards ID which will contain all the information needed by Yamaha to verify you own the packs you want to load.

This is not so simple for the buyer. Yamaha must transfer all packs from seller account to the new buyer account. The seller cannot simply give to the buyer the packs downloaded from its account. Buyer must insert User ID and password when he want to install those packs into YEM. And, in the same time, the buyer in his account does not have any purchased packs. He does not have possibility to download a pack from its account, even he register the keyboard in his account. Only if Yamaha will charge his account with all packs which was bought for that keyboard, but I don't think it will be ever accomplish this, because this is a hack in the system.

Regards,
Vali