Words ring true..

[Kytrinh]

Picked up the Genos yesterday.. in my opnion, its the best sounding arranger ever produced period!!
Looks ***y as, feels great to play, in my studio right now,  theres both T4&5, Korg Pa4x, Ketron Audya 5, Ketron SD40! From that list, in MY opinion Genos is King of the Crop! Doubt it if you will, ima gonna getta playin.!!
Love Yamaha..love all of You!!!

[Tankdave]

Good hearing something positve and with all those keyboards you have, you can sure make this statement 

[Kytrinh]

Good hearing something positve and with all those keyboards you have, you can sure make this satement 

Hi Tankdave
Yeah for months now theres been alot of debate, you tube comparisons of all sorts and id like to absorb as much info as i can before taking a leap. Im not one brand devoted nor bias. i enjoy all that im priviledged to have and Genos right now is in a different class of its own. I played the same style on the T5 then layered with the Genos and difference is night and day. T4 to T5 not so much, but Genos is the beginning of the new generation of sound. Its almost like a DJ mixing desk with so much more creativity.

[EileenL]

Yes Genos is the best one from Yamaha so far. Had mine since November and love it.

[Bud2]

I also agree that the Genos's is the best, only one or two small things I wish they had not altered but definitely nothing major.
Bill

[Kaarlo von Freymann]

...... in my studio right now,  theres both T4 & 5, Korg Pa4x, Ketron Audya 5, Ketron SD40!.......

May I ask you, are they just "left overs" or could you really go to a live performance with anyone of those ? Tyros 5/6 and Genos are  different, but not too different in their layout, but already that to me feels just as big a problem as trying to drive my friends Range Rover that he brought to Finland when moving here. It is the same model I have  (VERY old !) but of course has the steering wheel and the automatic's gear shift on the "wrong side".   Genos and Tyros have the tempo button and the  transpose buttons placed  only slightly differently, and already that makes me make mistakes when I switch.

Cheers

Kaarlo

[Kytrinh]

May I ask you, are they just "left overs" or could you really go to a live performance with anyone of those ?

Kaarlo

Hello Kaarlo
Yes, these boards serves specific purposes for what i do. Usually for church i would take the Audya/SD40 out as it has the audio styles which suits these types of music. The Ketron sound is clean, live and much less of the "electronic feel".
Occasionally i set up live shows where i invite guests singers to perform. These are ticket sale ones thus i take the T5/4x out to make sure i have the best possible sounds and variety of styles at my disposal. These boards contain alot of customed styles and sampled sounds to suit each individual song depending on the singers playlist which is arranged  beforehand. The T4 is now a backup to the T5 as it carries the bulk of these shows. Any private parties like weddings and Birthdays, these are also my go to boards.
Yes they all have different OS however having used to a variety of keyboards over the years including Roland, the Arranger section all serves the same purpose, the layout are just different, but a day or so with a new keyboard it should be good enough to take out on gigs.
I value on the sound that comes out of the FOH because thats what the audience will here, these shows are not about me, im just the bloke in the corner tapping, sliding, mixing and turning knobs and whatever else on these units to find and deliver the best possible sound to my audience... of course i get a huge thrill too.
Theres a wish list on every forum almost..right now Im more than thankful and priviledged to have most of those wishes come true.
Having all these boards is like have 4 kids in the family.. you love all of them, and they all have their own personalities, traits and skills.
Now with the Genos..the T4 is of age to be married and move out of home -:))
Just imagine..the Genos with the String Ensemble on the T5 and whatever else i can pull out of the 4X on the fly..
Regards
Ky

[Lloyd E]

Changes happen whenever a new board is introduced. It's up to the player to study these changes and get used to them.  Study the manual more and enjoy the changes. Lloyd

[Kaarlo von Freymann]

Hello Kaarlo
Yes, these boards serves specific purposes for what i do. Usually for church i would take the Audya/SD40 out as it has the audio styles which suits these types of music. The Ketron sound is clean, live and much less of the "electronic feel".
Occasionally i set up live shows where i invite guests singers to perform. These are ticket sale ones thus i take the T5/4x out to make sure i have the best possible sounds and variety of styles at my disposal. These boards contain alot of customed styles and sampled sounds to suit each individual song depending on the singers playlist which is arranged  beforehand. The T4 is now a backup to the T5 as it carries the bulk of these shows. Any private parties like weddings and Birthdays, these are also my go to boards.
Yes they all have different OS however having used to a variety of keyboards over the years including Roland, the Arranger section all serves the same purpose, the layout are just different, but a day or so with a new keyboard it should be good enough to take out on gigs.
I value on the sound that comes out of the FOH because thats what the audience will here, these shows are not about me, im just the bloke in the corner tapping, sliding, mixing and turning knobs and whatever else on these units to find and deliver the best possible sound to my audience... of course i get a huge thrill too.
Theres a wish list on every forum almost..right now Im more than thankful and priviledged to have most of those wishes come true.
Having all these boards is like have 4 kids in the family.. you love all of them, and they all have their own personalities, traits and skills.
Now with the Genos..the T4 is of age to be married and move out of home -:))
Just imagine..the Genos with the String Ensemble on the T5 and whatever else i can pull out of the 4X on the fly..
Regards
Ky

Thanks Kytrinhfor a very detailed answer. Hats off,  your capability to  master different keyboards amazes me. Already my cordless phone and mobile phone's different systems make me use the mobile just for answering calls   

Cheers

Kaarlo

[HalUnlimited]

Kytrinh, it's nice to read your positive post about the Genos that rings true from your wide experience and my personal experiences as well. It's hard for me to understand occasional heavy complaining when no one is forced to purchase any particular brand or model.  Yamaha (or any other brand) can't please all the people all of the time. Hal

[Toril S]

Congratulations on your Genos, Kythrinh!

[tyrosman]

yip Genos is just fantastic

[EileenL]

Yes Willie I agree but I sometimes feel a minority on here as you and I sit and set up our keyboards and play them live at gigs. I wonder how many others do this.

[tyrosman]

i wonder as well Eileen because all they do in moan about it and I'm getting sick of it I mean 10 boards about one Keyboard terrible

[soundphase]

i wonder as well Eileen because all they do in moan about it and I'm getting sick of it I mean 10 boards about one Keyboard terrible

Professionals wonder if a second-hand Tyros has a better quality-price ratio for their activity.  But they are torn between reason and passion. And they try to resist the temptation by "self convincing" discussions. It's not moans.
For me, things are easier, it's just my main pleasure : I know money is lost . As I could afford it, I didn't hesitate so long.

[tyrosman]

hi soundphase I was the same and I gig with mine ive done 3 so far and the sound is superb

[Keyboardist]

Congrats on your Genos,  Kytrinh
So many boards to be proud of to own !
There was a lot of flak pros and cons from many regarding the Genos, but it really should be tried for a while before passing judgment
Enjoy your new board and have fun playing.

Regards Craig "Keyboardist"

[EileenL]

Yes always when you get a new keyboard you should make sure you know what it dose and how to operate it.
  People are to quick to say it has bugs in it and it dose not do this or it dose not do that. More time getting to understand it will pay of in the end.

[JohnS (Ugawoga)]

Hi

Buttons and knobs in difrent places just mean a bit of extra practice until the brain picks it up

All the best
John

[Bud2]

Yes, I totally agree, I have had no problems using the Genos, I just had to find my way around it, just like you would do with a new car or one from a different manufacturer. Admitted it does take some people longer than others to do this but the beauty of these forums is, if you need any help there are a lot of people who are prepared to help in any way they can, with the attitude of "there is no such thing as a silly question" so no one need to be afraid to ask for help. 

[Kytrinh]

Congrats on your Genos,  Kytrinh
So many boards to be proud of to own !
There was a lot of flak pros and cons from many regarding the Genos, but it really should be tried for a while before passing judgment
Enjoy your new board and have fun playing.

Regards Craig "Keyboardist"

Thank you Craig.. yes Genos copped flak from the very first teaser video, then its up for comparison to every available board on the market upon its release..my conclusion is that you wont truly know until you have one and more so, like Eileen pointed out, through stage powered PA system, thats when you will then appreciate the separation, nuance and the new Revo drums kicking in!! Im super happy with the Genos and at the end of the day, its really me that matters -:)
Im not here boasting over lower end models as i do consider peoples needs and affordability are different and im sure they get just as much a thrill out of what they have as me and the Genos, but its really the bickering that sometimes get me... price wise, a 76key slimline, lightweight state of the art with the latest tech and  2G memory built in to boot..i cant complain.
Happy Playing Yamahadians..-:)
Ky

[Pianoman]

Professionals wonder if a second-hand Tyros has a better quality-price ratio for their activity.  But they are torn between reason and passion.

It's not moans.

Thank you for being so understanding Soundphase.

Since I have nothing better to do this morning, I'm sitting here counting/estimating
the number of gigs that I've played with my T3 since 2010.

A rough estimate would be around 2780 gigs, so I've gotten to know it quite well.

I bought the T3 two years after it's launch, and 10 weeks before the launch of the T4,
because my dealer told me that the T4 business was just a rumour.

I updated the T3 just once after I bought it, and have never had any trouble, bugs,
freezing, crashing, or any of the myriad other Genos related issues that one reads
about almost on a daily basis here.

One just has to start from the "Genos - General" page, then go backwards, from
page 1 to page 10, to read about all the issues that have been mentioned.

The T3 easily brings me an average of 1980€ every week.
Not much, I know, but the point is that it keeps bringing in an income.

I've always mantained that it is the musician that makes an instrument
sound good, and not the instrument making the musician good.

And to make an instrument sound good requires investing a substantial amount
of discipline, dedication, time, and sacrifice, something many people are unable,
or perhaps unwilling to do.

We live in the age of instant gratification, where one finger will give you an
Orchestra.
And sometimes no fingers at all, when you pop in a Midifile.

From a professional's point of view, I have nothing to gain by rushing out to buy a
Genos just because someone else has recommended it, and nothing to lose by waiting
until whatever remaining issues have been identified by others, and ultimately
ironed out.

Most comsumer products are rushed out nowadays anyway, before being fully tested for issues,
with the manufacturers depending on consumers to act as Guinea pigs who will identify any
remaining issues.

I probably will eventually end up getting a Genos, but that will be according to my own
timetable, even though I must admit that I also find the T5/61 an appealing prospect,
as well as being fascinated by the styles and real live band sensation that the Korg Pa4X
has.

I must also confess that I have neither seen nor tested either the T5 or Korg yet.
None of the stores here have them.

My assumptions are only based on YouTube videos that I have been watching.

Just a professional's point of view.

Best Regards.
Abby.


PS: I welcome any civil, constructive, and intelligent response.

[EileenL]

Yes Genos had a few teething problems as all new keyboards do. Geno is tested before leaving the factory but only to make sure all sections are doing what they should as regards to selecting the right sections when screen is touched. Yamaha can't possibly know how we are going to use the keyboard when we get it home. Some people will not have problems just sitting and playing it as a lot of us do. Others will want to connect other devices to it to make there music. This is where problems may be found and we then get in touch with Yamaha and these things are put right.
  I am surprised that anyone bought the keyboard by reading this forum and the bad press. A lot of faults reported were simply user error and not taking the time to get to know the new keyboard. Everything is there if you look for it and indead is the best keyboard produced by Yamaha so far. Sales alone show this but at the end of the day the choice is always ours. At 82 years of age I am loving every minute playing mine.

[soundphase]

I confirm that we could easily play Genos without experimenting annoying bugs.
From T3 to Genos, I found a lot of annoying bugs on the T5. They were corrected by later firmware updates.
For the features I use, it's not the case with the Genos.

I don't think all Taxi drivers own the latest model and most powerful car from one brand, when their customers only want to be driven confortably for a reasonable price. But they want the driver knows how to drive safely.

[Gunnar Jonny]

You know Abby, if you take a well used hammer from a handyman and give him a new one, he will hit the wrong point quite often before he is comfortable with the new tool.
Most often professionals don't wanna change tools that works well, and I think it's the same way to musicians. 
During the years the T3 and the other equipment you're using is trimmed to become 'The Pianoman Band', so as they say: Why change a winning team?

Back to the handyman and his hammer .... 
During the years there has been some developements, and new hammers powered by air and electrisity is invented.
If try to take the new tools away from the pro worker, you're probably get into trouble..... 

Btw, only technical problem I've had withGenos is that the sondlevel did drop during play at right 1 voices. But all that sudden that stopped, never seen that 'fault' again.
Maybe this one of the 'minor fixes' taken care of by updates, or maybe it's me that had a personal bug sorted out, who knows? 

[Pianoman]

I don't think all Taxi drivers own the latest model and most powerful car from one brand, when their customers only want to be driven confortably for a reasonable price. But they want the driver knows how to drive safely.

Another great example from you Soundphase, with the Taxi analogy.

About the constant reference to Genos sales figures, I've read a comment
on this forum which gave another car analogy.

This is what the commenter said:

"Then they point to sales figures as the justification. Well, the best selling car in
America  is a pickup truck. Anyone here wants to tell me that's the best vehicle
on American roads?

The Genos is a good keyboard, and I'm confident that the bugs will be sorted out
eventually, like they have been with previous keyboards, and I may still get one later
on.

but so is it's predecessor, and the difference is not huge, despite what the faithful
want to believe and claim.

I've had the opportunity of playing one five times now.

Best Regards.
Abby.

[EileenL]

It always takes time to get used to a new keyboard because we expect it to sound like the old one. Of course it doesn't, but isn't that why we bought it. If you want it to sound like an earlier keyboard then use the Legacy voices to do this. You can also download and use Audio Styles if you prefer them. They can now be used from a USB stick.
  Most of all enjoy your music.

[travlin-easy]

This is probably one of the only instances that I must disagree with my friend Abby. While it is true that it is the player that makes the keyboard sound good, the keyboard itself has a significant bearing on how the player sounds as well.

Yesterday, I tried to help someone that just purchased a Korg PA600. It had some nice features, touch screen, good key feel, etc... However, it sounded just awful. The pianos were thin, the guitars didn't even sound like guitars, and the sax sounds were horrible, sounding more like a kazoo than a sax. In contrast, my PSR-S-950 sounded so much more authentic that the guy I was trying to help decided to return his PA-600 and buy a new PSR-S975.

Good topic,

Gary

[DonM]

Gary as we discussed, the Korg probably needed e.q.  I didn't have a 600, but I did have 800, 900 PA3X and PA4X and they all sounded fantastic with great styles and sounds and wonderful vocal processing.
When you pull up some of the lead sounds, they can sound not so great.  Just as on the Yamahas, it's best and easiest to find OTS settings where the manufacturer has added effects and tweaked. 
Too bad it's like that, but it seems to be a common thing affecting all brands.
As I dimly recall, it took you weeks or months to get the 950 like you wanted it.

[Pianoman]

I've always mantained that it is the musician that makes an instrument
sound good, and not the instrument making the musician good.

And to make an instrument sound good requires investing a substantial amount
of discipline, dedication, time, and sacrifice, something many people are unable,
or perhaps unwilling to do.

Hello Gary.

It's good to see you here. I thought you might have been out sailing.
I know that you've been working on the boat.
I suppose the weather is still not optimal.

What I meant with the above comments is that dedicating a fair amount of time
to musicianship, as well as tweaking your instrument, is essential to making one
sound good.

I'm still tweaking my keyboard every night during gigs, for the last 8 years.

The instrument can't do it all for someone, no matter how sophisticated it is.

Many people may not have the time, or the will, to dedicate a sizable chunk of
their daily life to such an essential undertaking.


Best Regards.
Abby.

My greetings to you too Don.