General YEM LSB question

[chony]

In YEM I've found that when I change the LSB# of a YAMAHA expansion pack, the styles and voices in that pack still reference each other correctly. That's an interesting phenomena because the styles are pre-programmed with the particular LSB# of each voice. So I'm not sure how the style knows that the voice LSB# has changed.

What I'm trying to figure out is: How do I do that on MY OWN packs? I have my own custom styles and I use my own custom voices in them. But even though I group those styles and voices in the same pack, when I change the LSB#, the styles no longer find the correct voices.

Help?

[Marcus]

Can you not just load your expansion packs exactly the same way as your Tyros 5 or have your voices and style grouped the same way in the YEM. You can also rename a LSB# to whatever number you want inside the YEM from "My Packs"- "Change Bank Select LSB"?

I will have to be careful with my Custom Expansion as well, when I upload my Tyros 5 Expansion Packs to my Genos (if and when that is). The LSB selection was a nice upgrade feature to the YEM.

Marcus

[overover]

Hi Chony,

Voices in Yamaha PREMIUM Expansion Packs has FIXED Voice adresses (different from MSB 62/63). When a Premium Pack is imported into YEM, however, it is automatically assigned also to the lowest free LSB# of the CUSTOM VOICE address range (MSB 62 and 63). But a Premium Pack normally does NOT need this LSB! So, you can change the LSBs Premium Packs as YOU like. I always assign Premium Packs to the highest possible LSBs (127, 126 and so on), directly after importing the Packs into YEM.

When you change LSB of an OWN Packs or of a Pack that was imported by a .ppf file before, the Style/Midifiles/Multi Pads that were included in that Packs will be updated with the "new" LSB# automatically, if Custom Voices (MSB 62 or 63) are used therein. Finally, the modified contents must be transferred to the instrument again, of course.

I recommend to make a screen shot of the window "Change Bank Select LSB", whenever something has changed.

P.S.
If you have recoiced Styles which are stored OUTSIDE the Pack that contains the relevant Voices, you either have to leave the Pack at its original LSB (respectively change the LSB to its original value again) OR you have to revoice these Styles once more with the NEW Voice adresses, when LSB has changed.

[valio7771]

Hi Chony !

Well, if you add new packs they occupy the next available free LSB# after the ones that are currently installed. But if you uninstall the ones that you've used in the your user styles and install another pack, the newly installed pack takes the LSB# of your previous packs because that's the first free available LSB#.  Example:

Your Expansion Pack X- LSB 001, MSB 62 and 63
Your Expansion Pack Y- LSB 002, MSB 62 and 63
at this point your styles work properly....

If you install Your Expansion Pack Z on it's own, this will remove Packs X and Y and Your Expansion Pack Z will be LSB 001, MSB 62 and 63, and your styles will not find the appropriate sounds because they are not in the same location. That's why this happens.

I will suggest if you install the packs you've had before first, than make a new pack that will include the packs X,Y and Z together, that way the new pack will have the next available LSB# (003,004....127) without changing the locations of the previously installed packs.

Hope it was useful.

Get back if you need more help with that.

Valentin

[chony]

Hi Chony !

I will suggest if you install the packs you've had before first, than make a new pack that will include the packs X,Y and Z together, that way the new pack will have the next available LSB# (003,004....127) without changing the locations of the previously installed packs.

Hope it was useful.

Get back if you need more help with that.

Valentin

We are trying to build a pack that we can sell. We need it to work exactly like YAMAHA's packs, or people will want refunds if the particular LSB# that we have programmed to is already taken on their YEM. So the advice I'm looking for is exactly how to make a pack where the STYLES will reference VOICES no matter what the LSB# is.

[overover]

We are trying to build a pack that we can sell. We need it to work exactly like YAMAHA's packs, or people will want refunds if the particular LSB# that we have programmed to is already taken on their YEM. So the advice I'm looking for is exactly how to make a pack where the STYLES will reference VOICES no matter what the LSB# is.

Hi Chony,

I recommend the following method:

• Make a Pack with the Voices (actual LSB in YEM is NOT relevant).

• As a backup you can export this pack in .ppf format.

• Make the Styles and revoice them with the Voices of the Pack.

• Import the Styles into the Pack (beside the Voices).

• Make a backup of the now completed Pack in .ppf format.

• Export the pack in .cpf (encrypted), using the individual .n27 files of your customers.

• Either the .ppf version or the .cpf versions of the pack (containing Voices AND Styles) can be imported into YEM and the Styles will ALWAYS work (with ANY LSB), because when a .ppf or .cpf Pack that contains STYLES is imported, the Styles will be changed  automatically to work with the current LSB that was assigned (automatically) to the Pack at importing process.

If needed, the user can also change the LSB of the Pack manually, and the Styles will still work, because also in this case the Styles (which are in the Pack) will be changed  automatically to fit the current Pack LSB.

Best Regards,
Chris

P.S.
Normally, you can NOT make a Pack like Yamaha PREMIUM Packs (that uses FIXED Voice adresses like Preset Voices). To do this, you have to be in direct cooperation with Yamaha. Otherwise you can only make a Pack, that uses CUSTOM VOICE adresses (for Drum Voices: MSB 62, for Normal Voices: MSB 63). LSB of each Pack is variable (as mentioned, the current LSB is not relevant as long as the STYLES are in the same Pack).

[chony]

Overover,

It sounds like good advice. Do you know this to work, or is this a guess?

[alvinc]

Hi Chony,

I came across this problem months ago. Styles in YAMAHA official packs do change LSB selection automatically no matter which number you assign. So the styles go with their packs will always find the right voices. I guess YEM openned to users must be limited in many features. The 'fully-function version' (which will not be disclosed to users) can definitely do the setting.
Have you found a way to solve this problem?

BTW, there are a lot of restrictions in the YEM V2.5
For instance, the voices in official packs are with lock icon, which must be done in their 'fully-function version' .
Also, we are not unable to create mega voices/S!Art Voices....

[valimaties]

Hi Chony,

I came across this problem months ago. Styles in YAMAHA official packs do change LSB selection automatically no matter which number you assign. So the styles go with their packs will always find the right voices. I guess YEM openned to users must be limited in many features. The 'fully-function version' (which will not be disclosed to users) can definitely do the setting.
Have you found a way to solve this problem?

BTW, there are a lot of restrictions in the YEM V2.5
For instance, the voices in official packs are with lock icon, which must be done in their 'fully-function version' .
Also, we are not unable to create mega voices/S!Art Voices....

Mega Voices are multiple-samples on each note sample, so , you can make MegaVoices whenever you want
S!Art are a little bit more complex, as they use scripts, and are only played (you will not find midi events in a midi file if you use S!Arts voices)...

@pjd has an article on how is build a megavoice on Yamaha, the expression values "from-to" which you can use

[alvinc]

Mega Voices are multiple-samples on each note sample, so , you can make MegaVoices whenever you want
S!Art are a little bit more complex, as they use scripts, and are only played (you will not find midi events in a midi file if you use S!Arts voices)...

@pjd has an article on how is build a megavoice on Yamaha, the expression values "from-to" which you can use

Hi Vali, thank you for your inputs.
Indeed megavoice is a kind of multi-layer voice. But the problem lies in each layer with an independent velocity-volume sence, for instance,  for the built-in megavoice, layer 1 (velocity 1-21) volume goes up in a liner way, when it goes to layer 2 (velocity 22-40) the volume also goes up from velocity 22 to 40 independently. This means that velocity 21 is actually louder than velocity 22. It seems that in current YEM version we cannot edit as built-in megavoice does. I will read Paul's article to find out more secret about this.
For S.Art! voice, there are some legato ect skills involved. Not sure whether YAMAHA will disclose this function later in YEM updated version.