Real Audio Loops (guitar) on Psr s970 Styles?

[Enildo]

Like I said, I can not explain the subject here. There are 5 programs used + settings on the keyboard.
A simple detail forgotten and will miss. I also can not record a video, because it would be a video of 4 to 6 hours to explain everything.
Understand me please!

Enildo

[Henni]

Hi Enildo,

I am interested.

+27 671336955

Kind regards,

Henni
South Africa

[Enildo]

Enildo, when you asked help here we try to give you. So I hope you help me too.

I just wanted to say that I already helped and I continue to help those who need this forum here.
But we can not always do everything.
I have my limitations too!

Thank you to everyone who understands
Enildo

[bernamato]

Done!

This tutorial is what I was looking for.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbrM-OB97K8

[Enildo]

Done!

This tutorial is what I was looking for.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbrM-OB97K8

This tutorial teaches you how to make loops for the "kontakt" program and not for internal use.
My method is much simpler and more objective, and loops are installed on the keyboard in the "PPI or CPI" format, usually by YEM.
But glad you're satisfied. I am happy with the happiness of other people and their achievements!

Enildo

[Enildo]

I apologize to all forum friends who are interested in this subject, but it is difficult for me to teach everyone who has an interest,
both in the complexity of the explanations and in the language.
Even here in Brazil I am thinking of not teaching more, because it is a subject that generates many doubts and since I have other tasks,
I am not able to attend to everybody.

Enildo

[Enildo]

I'm level II (let's put it this way) on this subject of real audio loops, and I'm working to ease some of the procedures,
as well as improving the operation of loops to avoid gagging, crashes and so on.

Enildo

[stefanobean]

Hi, after long study, I'm done with audio drum in recycle (that sound perfect) and audio live guitar (only little problem).
I use cubase 10, kontakt  Recycle, csm editor, style split splice and maybe more software.
The tutorial has help me.

My mode is to start adjust the original wav for perfect loop, then I create every single cutted wav
and it can do from recycle (export mode) or cubase too. (a complex 2 bar loop can have 16 single wav)
Then edit each single wav and remapped in kontakt  every slice note to velocity 127, 126 125 ecc ...
and then create the final sf2 for import into expansion manager.

Of course I want to use in genos and not play directly from kontakt like the video.
I'm try to sample my acustic live guitar from ketron sd9
I have only one problem: The guitar loop slice. It's so difficult to slice every note in recycle.. and question one:
If every note recycled has personal slice... so which part slice midi import into the style? It's impossible to crate a midi part for every note.

So my solution is to recycle slice note in standard 1/8 or 16/16 piece. for every loop. (recycle can automatic create 16/16 slice)
Then the midi slice part is only 1 (uguale for every note).... Then all work perfect, time note majour minour ecc..   exept  the sound!!!!

I try to change every parametre in recycle and try to create every 16 wav file from cubase too (without recycle) but same result
A slice of 8/8 or 16/16  create a bad sound (at original bpm too) when reproduced.  (it's not like drum)
So I can have live guitar that play good only if zero slice  but then I cannot down or up the tempo
More slice and can have more down/up the tempo, but at minimun the result is bad too!!!

Set 4/4 slice is not enough... and 8/8  slice result final wav terrible  (at 16/16 more bad)

Please who can help me?

[Balkanbeat]

Hello,
I made a new account just to get into this topic.
I am very interested in how this is done as well..
Creating time slice grooves with drums/percussion is easy because most arrangers do have this option.
So of what i have seen and read is that it is a guitar loop in this case
is a multisample of chords and then is sliced into a groove from highest (127) to lower velocity's
(126, 125, 124, 123, 122, 121, 120 etc..) from here you can use a midi groove that you can create with a software called "ReCycle", you then play the stacatto notes exactly the same as this midi groove has been created from ReCycle. But is it possible to create this inside the keyboard instead of using this software for pc? All i know it is possible.. but how exactly i don't know, yes it seems very complicated but there has to be a way to get this working all on the arranger.
It has also been done on a Korg Pa800/pa1x/pa2x/pa3x/pa4x.
If somebody can make a english tutorial on how to do this it would be very helpfull.
I make balkan music so we have the exact issue with live performance, the most hardest instrument to emulate is a electric guitar, also the styles come more alive as well.

And for the record i also know the Gem WK6/WK8 had the possibility to create automatic chords from a live loop (guitar, bass.. etc..) this is called a R.A.S.S Style (Real Audio Synchro Style) but shame Gem never promoted this further into the future.

https://youtu.be/5Yh9l14EcEk

Here's a video of live loop guitar styles created on Gem Wk6/Wk8 & Korg Pa800.

[Balkanbeat]

Here is more of live guitar loops on arranger keyboard

https://youtu.be/mvZlZ4QezWk

https://youtu.be/Gmk6Y3jE9us

[bernamato]

Hi all.
The solution I found is to play exactly the midi note exported from recycle and .wav audio, of course.
Assign the audio samples with different velocity in one channel corresponding to a single note. Every channel has its chord. After use casm editor to exclude for each channel the note that you wan't play and with chord has not assigned. In this way for each midi pattern derivates from recycle you can play one chord perfectly in timing and with no degrading sounds.That is alll

[Balkanbeat]

Can somebody make video tutorial how to do this on keyboard arranger? Step to step

[gabrielschuck]

Hi Enildo and others,
Interesting to find a topic on this subject here!
I'm also one of the people here in Brazil who was already researching and trying to understand how Brazilian style programmers manage to make these tricks.
From what I could find out and also from the information brought here, we don't need to go very far. Yamaha has already done this and certainly someone very expert has understood the logic and is using it creatively.

The first proof of this is in yamaha's own "Alpen Pack". For users who have this pack, a special attention to the last voice that I don't remember the exact name now, I know for sure that it's the last one.
Notice that when playing the notes individually, what you hear (depending on the intensity) is a chord and not a single note. And there are variations of that same chord depending on the velocity layers.
So, in one octave are the major chords, in the other the minor ones and also the 7th chords.
What happens is what Enildo suggests. There is an instruction in the style file to play the notes of a certain octave according to the instructed chord. If it is major, it uses the corresponding notes of the major chords of one octave of the voice, if it is minor of another octave, and so on.
In practice it would be like recording a bass single note always using the root of the chord, without any ostinato. When playing the style, the keyboard understands that it must use the root of the chord. But the sample assigned to that note is the chord itself with variations.
No need to use a separate channel for each chord anymore.
I remember like it was today when I played a special chord like those with the 7th in some styles of the PSR510 and suddenly I heard a cymbal more in style. This shows that Yamaha already did this by defining a behavior to the style when certain chord changes occur.
Some more current styles (and again the Alpen pack is a great reference), when the chord, for example, is a minor seventh, the bass line happens to do the opposite, that is, instead of playing the tonic of the chord first, it plays the fifth for then the tonic.

Of course, using a real loop instrument as the basis for a style has its advantages and disadvantages.
Joe is also right, in general the vast majority of styles have always used midi and, of course, depending on the voices (which may even be from the keyboard itself) it is possible to achieve impressive results while saving expansion memory space.

I don't know if I made myself understood either, my English isn't that good either.
regards,
Gabriel

[bernamato]

Could you tell us the "instructions" in the styles you are referring to? What kind of instructions? Can I compile the "instructions" in the "style creator" or do we have to use an external application?

[ckobu]

Guitars of this type (audio guitar) are made the way I showed in the video. It takes time, effort and knowledge.
It's too much work and the result is not always good.

https://youtu.be/7zQaOUsZHW0

[bernamato]

I forgot to split in three zone the cord type. For example, we can assign major chords to a low zone, a minor chords in a middle zone and a 7th chords in upper zone. Question: for the rest of chords type (m7th, maj9th etc.) do we need to use another channel?
Tks a lot for your assistence.

[ckobu]

...For example, we can assign major chords to a low zone, a minor chords in a middle zone and a 7th chords in upper zone...

This cannot be done because only one Switch Chord configuration can be assigned to one channel. If we specify three zones on that channel, they will all have the same Chord Switch configuration.

[ckobu]

Hi Enildo and others,
...
No need to use a separate channel for each chord anymore.

That can't be done, and I wrote here why.

This cannot be done because only one Switch Chord configuration can be assigned to one channel. If we specify three zones on that channel, they will all have the same Chord Switch configuration.

To clarify the example of the FastPolkaKrainer Style found in the Genos V2.0 SuperiorPack. Guitar (CHD1) plays on Channel 12 and is created in the way I described in my video posted in post #74. Only one tone (c) is played on the 12th channel, but the whole chord is heard, in fact the major is played there (picture). The same guitar is played on channels 2, 3, 4, 5 and 8, but with a different harmonic structure. Specifically, noise effects are inserted on channels 2 and 8 to make the guitar sound more natural. It's like Multivoice sounds.
I will repeat, there is no way to combine all harmonic shapes on just one channel with this method. Multiple channels must be used if we want Style to sound right.

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[love4music]

Hi to everyone !
Take a look ...
https://youtu.be/nbu6WhfC-z4

[bernamato]

An example:
https://youtu.be/lly2evMCXP0


Thanks.

[love4music]

Hi everyone ! try this.. 

https://youtu.be/nbu6WhfC-z4