Registrations for PSR-E433

[Mick47]

Gday
Have an E433..Have not been on this forum for a long time.I seem to remember some members showing some registrations for popular songs that I could set up on my E433
Just wondering if I would be able to access some to get me restarted on my keyboard again
Regards Mick


Edit: Topic title modified by overover

[Mick47]

Guess I should explain better.
I'm after some completed registrations that members have shared before..eg..whiter shade of pale sound  or that unique Shadows sound etc.
Have tried myself and had little luck.
Ta

[SciNote]

I've been using a PSR-E433 as my main keyboard for more than a decade now, and I've come up with lots of sounds and registrations for it.  However, I don't normally make song-specific registrations.  As there are only 32 registrations available, I have general registrations arranged in categories that I can use for many songs.  As the 32 registrations are arranged in eight banks, I use each bank for a different category.  So, I have a bank dedicated to 1960's and more Classic-type rock, a bank dedicated to the music of Vangelis, a bank set up for orchestral sounds, like strings and brass, a bank set up for sounds suited for the music of Enya, a bank for 1970's-80's rock, one that is for rock but more orchestral in nature, a bank for Christmas music, and finally, a bank for jazz and big-band music.  Of course, often banks set up for a certain genre can be used for various other songs, as well.  For example, I find my "Enya" bank works great for some Neil Diamond music, as well.  While it is possible to have additional registrations in a flash drive hooked to the USB port, I don't currently use this feature.  It can take over ten seconds to load different USR files, which could be cumbersome when changing settings between songs.

When possible, I also try to follow a certain format for arranging the presets within each bank.  I use the first one for piano-type sounds, the second one for organ, the third one for strings or guitar, and the fourth one for fullest and lushest sound of the bank.  Of course, depending on the set of sounds, there may be some exceptions.  Almost all of my registrations use a main voice, a dual voice, and a split voice, and I have discovered here that having different pan settings for the main and dual voices can really enhance the stereo imaging of a registration.

While a listing of all of the parameters of my registrations would make for huge post, I can post some more general information, if you want.  Or, I can post the details a little at a time.

Also, I only use styles for the drums, and I often switch registrations during a song, so I've set up each registration so that they will not change the currently playing style (let me know if you don't know how to do this but want to know).  I also almost always set up a split voice for a good full bass sound to play with my left hand.  To that end, I have found a couple sounds that work very well for the split voice...

Sound 154, RS Saw 1, with octave setting of -1, and
Sound 007, MIDI Grand, also with octave setting of -1

The RS Saw 1 sound has a good "punch" at the beginning of the sound for emphasis, and it does not fade out when notes are held down, which allows it to also be used when you want a full steady sound in the background.  The MIDI Grand is kind of like a piano on steroids, and when set to octave -1, the lower notes take on a bass-drum quality, allowing for a very full and versatile left hand accompaniment sound.  The notes do fade out if you hold them down, but at least it takes a few seconds for that to happen.  Of course, some of my registrations do use other sounds for the split voice.

Since the sustain pedal cannot sustain the left side of a split keyboard, I usually put a lot of reverb in the split voice so that the sound doesn't just completely die out when I let go of the keys -- I use a level of around 100 with the Hall 3 reverb setting.  I also usually add a good amount of chorusing to animate the sound, as well.

Also note that I make use of the filter settings for the live control knobs to make temporary changes to the sound for certain songs, so I usually set up registrations that have the filter as the default setting for the knobs.  For example, I have a rock-organ sound set up for a registration in my 1970's-80's rock bank.  But by adjusting the filter settings, I can give this sound some more "bite" -- a Hammond-style keyboard click -- when I want it.  Of course, if I then change the registration while playing a song, then go back to the organ, then those changes will not be there.

One more bit of information.  Some sounds can be quite versatile, and I have recently discovered sound number 469, Choir/Strings.  Now, this is one of the XGLite voices, and for some reason, many of those voices have a very low volume setting for default.  But if you boost the volume and add some reverb and chorusing, this sound is quite good.  And then when combined with another voice (using main and dual voices), it gives the effect of having three different sounds at once on the right hand.

Let me know if this is helpful, and if you would like some more detail for some of my patches/registrations.

[Mick47]

Wow..Bob just found this and wanted to thank you .
Will get back soon

[Mick47]

Gday Bob
Really thankfull for  all that .Have read it through and understand some of it but not all. Makes so much sense to accommodate many songs by simply using  different genres.
I would imagine it's taken a long time to put all these registrations together but a copy would be fantastic.
Would it be okay by email?
I'm sure I will have other questions..drums etc.
Thanks again
Mick

[SciNote]

Okay, I appreciate the input.  When I get a chance, I'll post the settings of a few of my registrations to get started.  Keep in mind, my specific sounds and procedures for registrations may or may not be best for you.  For example, I said one of my banks is dedicated to the music of Enya, but if you do not like or play her music, then those sounds may not be best for your keyboard -- however, like I said before, I find these sounds are useful for a variety of songs, not just those by Enya.

And to get started, I explain how to save a registration so that it will not change the style when selected.  First, a little background.  For many people, the idea of a registration is kind of a "one-stop shop" for a particular song.  So, they set up the sounds and the style -- including the tempo -- for a particular song, and save it in a registration.  That way, when they want to play that song, they just select that registration, and everything, including the style, is good to go.  However, I just use the registrations for sound settings, and not for the style -- much like a synthesizer player would use the memory presets on their synthesizer to just store various sounds, without regard to any background style or rhythm.  And like I said, with only 32 registrations (without an external flash drive), trying to have song-specific registrations would be quite limiting on this keyboard.

Therefore, I set the registrations so that they will not change the style.  This way, I can select a style and tempo, and as I play along with that style at the selected tempo, I can change the sounds I am using throughout a song (such as selecting different sounds for different verses, or for verses and choruses of the songs), without the style and tempo abruptly changing when I change the sound.

The way to do this is, before you start setting up a registration, press the SONG button in the bank of four main selection buttons.  These are the four buttons that can light up labeled SONG, PATTERN, STYLE, and VOICE.  I know that if you push the STYLE button first, and then set up your registration, it will save whatever style you select to that registration, so that if you select that registration when playing, then the keyboard will abruptly change the style and tempo to whatever is stored in that registration.  But if you select the SONG button first, since the keyboard cannot save a song in a registration, it does not save anything (as far as background style or accompaniment).  Therefore, once such a registration is saved, you can have a particular style playing at a particular tempo, and when you select that registration, the style or tempo will NOT change.

I've got to get to work now -- I'll write more later.

[Mick47]

Selecting SONG first is very  appealing..keeping  the tempo also a great benefit .
Did attempt registrations when i first got the E433 many years ago.They were set up around different songs i was playing and it was a bit disastrous.
Take your  point regarding different genres of music..certainly would be interested in the 1960s,orchestral and rock .

[SciNote]

Okay, I've written down the parameters of three of my registrations.  I did this before I read your last post -- so, I was lucky that I included a couple orchestral set-ups.  I also included one of the Enya set-ups.  I'll post some of the rock sounds next.

I also made a couple sample recordings using these sounds.  Since they include copyrighted material, I will just send you the links in a private message (let me know if you did not get the message or have any trouble with the links).  But before proceeding, let me provide a little more important background information.  First of all, an important thing I forgot to mention before is that I always use an external amp and speakers, so this greatly enhances the sound compared to the small built-in speakers.  I also use an external reverb pedal, which provides additional reverb for the entire keyboard.  I originally started doing this because I thought there may have been something wrong with the internal reverb on my keyboard, but I have since come to realize that this was not the case.  However, using the external reverb pedal gives the style drums reverb, which is not possible with the onboard features of the E433, so it does provide that benefit.  With that said, when I recorded the samples of music, the "patch point" in the set up -- where I connect to the computer for recording -- is before the reverb pedal, so its effects are not recorded.  So to make it sound more like what I hear, I added reverb to the entire tracks using the DAW on my computer, which is Audacity software.  Note that, except for reverb for the drums, you should be able to emulate the sound I get pretty well by using the keyboard's onboard reverb at higher levels.

Additionally, since I use external amps and speakers, you may want to tweak some of the main settings to give a fuller sound if you are just using the built-in speakers.  You can try the BOOST setting of the main EQ/equalizer (I have been using the basic SPEAKER setting since I'm using outboard speakers and amps), and also experiment with the "ultra-wide stereo" effect, which is accessible by setting the knobs functions to function set number 5 (using the little white selector button by the knobs), and then adjusting it with the right-hand side knob.  But while these steps can enhance the sound, you'll never get a really full bass sound out of the small built-in speakers.

And in fact, I encourage you to experiment with the sounds in general.  These settings work for what I do, but you can certainly experiment with different settings.  For example, I like a lot of reverb and almost always use the Hall-3 setting (reverb setting number 3) for reverb.  But if you don't want that much reverb, or if you want a different type, you can try different types of reverb.  Additionally, as I went through the details of these registrations, I found that I am also using the Detuned CP-80 sound (number 279) as a full "piano on steroids" sound for the split voice, as well.  I may have to go through some of my registrations to see which is better -- the Midi Grand or the Detuned CP-80.  It seems the Midi Grand has more highs, while the Detuned CP-80 has more bass.

With all that said, here are the settings.  Note that all the dots are between the labels and numbers are to try to keep the columns lined up.  And if the information is not lined up properly on a phone screen, then you may want to try a device with a larger screen.

Orchestra -- Full brass/orchestra sound
--------------------------------------------------
.....................................Main.....................Dual...................Split..............
Voice ....................133-BrassSect..........67-Strings.......590-Halo Pad .....
Volume ..........................80.........................90.....................105..............
Octave ............................0.......................... -1..................... -1...............
Pan ...............................64.........................64.......................64..............
Reverb ..........................59.........................59......................100.............
Chorus ..........................64.........................64......................100.............
Attack ............................64........................64.........................................
Release .........................64.........................64........................................
Cutoff ............................64........................125.......................................
Resonance ....................64........................109.......................................

Reverb: 3-Hall3, Chorus: 4-Flanger2


Orchestra - Strings
------------------------
.....................................Main.....................Dual...................Split..............
Voice .......................67-Strings.............102-Choir........7-Midi Grand........
Volume .........................100........................115.....................105............
Octave ............................0.......................... -1..................... -1...............
Pan ...............................64.........................64.......................64..............
Reverb ............................0...........................0......................127.............
*** You may want to try higher reverb for main/dual voices
Chorus ..........................80.........................80......................110.............
Attack ............................45.........................80.........................................
Release .........................60.........................64.........................................
Cutoff ............................53.........................75.........................................
Resonance ....................70.........................90.........................................

Reverb: 3-Hall3, Chorus: 2-Chorus2


Enya -- Full sound
-----------------------
.....................................Main.....................Dual...................Split..............
Voice .......................67-Strings..........103-Vocal Ens.......279-Det-CP80...
Volume .........................100.........................90.....................102............
Octave ........................... -1..........................0..................... -1...............
Pan ................................25.......................100.....................64...............
Reverb ..........................112......................112....................110..............
Chorus ..........................120......................120....................115..............
Attack ...............................0.........................80.......................................
Release ...........................75........................64.......................................
Cutoff ..............................64........................64.......................................
Resonance ......................96........................96.......................................

Reverb: 3-Hall3, Chorus: 1-Chorus1

[casiokid]

Thanks @SciNote....what speaker-amp are you using?

[Mick47]

Those sound recordings are a credit to you Bob.What you have produced from this little keyboard is amazing. Thanks for the parameters/registrations. Look forward to the others.

[SciNote]

Thanks for the feedback!  I'll try to get some rock sounds posted within a few days.

As far as the amp that I am using -- for gigging purposes, I kind of "Frankensteined" a custom amp together using small amps I ordered from Amazon, and I put everything in a cabinet that I built myself.  There are these small DC-powered amps, and they're quite powerful.  I mean, you won't fill up a stadium with sound, but for something like a large dining room, they have plenty of power.  So, I got one for the highs, and one for the bass.  I don't know how reliable they will be for the long term, but I have been practicing with this set-up for a couple years, and I have taken it on a couple gigs so far with very little trouble.

I have a basic 10 inch woofer for the bass, and a pair of 6.5 inch Kicker car speakers for the highs.  However, I found that I did not get much imaging due to all of the speakers being close together, so I added jacks on the side to hook up a pair of satellite speakers, and I put together a couple 6x9 Kicker car speakers in speaker boxes for the satellite speakers.  There is also a switch to choose between the internal and external speakers, since allowing them to be all played together would drop the ohm-load to a level that is too low for the amp.

On the top of the amp, I have a small mixer to take up to three inputs and send them to the small amplifiers, and I put a Boss reverb pedal in line to give the whole sound some reverb.

Here are some photos.  Click on the links to view the photos.  Note:  If someone can tell me how to post photos so that the images show directly in the post, please let me know.

https://app.box.com/s/l4ib70frygcob4563u7nezybtm3isbqf
https://app.box.com/s/w34xnr3333bswqchzvzu21o2hj0d2k0i
https://app.box.com/s/16d5cytxtx3wxgzs1e9279te0ysujeh1
https://app.box.com/s/mloqo91lhkacxsv19yjsxtkxz0o9sppq

[casiokid]

Thanks SciNote -looks very neat

[Mick47]

This is all a bit embarrassing but trying to set up your registrations and running into problems. I hit SONG first  and try to do main VOICE..do I set all aspects of main voice then go on to DUEL and SPLIT?
I do have a manual but it seems to only show how to load your parameters to the bank...it's getting the parameters set up that's my problem.
Reset the keyboard to factory before this.
Ta Mick

[SciNote]

That is a very good question, as it is a kind of roundabout way that all this has to be done.

First of all, always select your main voice first.  The reason is that, when you set a main voice, the keyboard is programmed to automatically set a dual voice that Yamaha feels matches the main voice well.  So, if you set your dual voice first, then set the main voice, your dual voice is going to change (unless it just happens to be the same as what Yamaha sets -- and even then, some of the parameters may still change).

After pushing the song button in the group of four white buttons, you then hit the Voice button to select the main voice.  Just use the keypad or data wheel to change voices.  The Category plus and minus buttons will jump to different categories of voices, like piano, organ, or brass.

Now, once that is set, it gets tricky.  The only way that I know of to access the different parameters (like volume, octave, and filter settings) for the main voice is through the function list.  And the easiest way that I have found to access the main voice parameters is to push and HOLD DOWN (for a couple seconds) the dual voice button.  Yes, this brings you to the dual voice parameters, but at that point, you can use the Category plus and minus keys to go back into the main voice parameters.  The Category plus button will step you through the dual voice parameters, but the Category minus button will then step you backwards through the main voice parameters.  Once a parameter is on screen, you can change it.

Then, to set up the dual voice and its parameters, hit and HOLD DOWN the dual voice button again.  The first thing that comes up is the tone number for the dual voice, so you can set your dual voice tone there.  Then, just use the Category plus button to step through the dual voice parameters and change them as needed.

Finally, do the same for split voice -- hit and hold down the split voice button for a couple seconds.  That takes you right to the split voice tone number.  Set the split voice there, then use the Category plus button to step through and set the split voice parameters.

Finally make sure that dual and split voice modes are both set to on.  To do this, you just TAP the dual voice and split voice buttons (don't hold them down), and check their status on the display to make sure they are on.

Finally, save the settings in a registration.  There is more to discuss here, but I don't have time right now -- I'll give more details later.  But this should get you started.

[SciNote]

ADDITIONAL INFORMATION

If you haven't read my post, above, that describes how to access the different parameters for main, dual, and split voices, read that first.

Some of the other parameters you'd want to store in the registration include the overall reverb type and overall chorus type.  The easiest way that I have found to get to these parameters is to first hold down the split voice button for a couple seconds, which of course brings up the split voice tone and then allows you to step through the split voice parameters with the Category plus button.  But after you go through the split voice parameters with the Category plus button, then next parameters you can access through the Category plus button are the overall reverb and chorus types.  And, once those parameters are on the screen, you can set them just like the parameters of the main, dual, and split voices, and those changes can be saved in a registration.

Going beyond the reverb and chorus types gets you to the Master EQ and Stereo Wide parameters.  I honestly don't remember if those get stored in a registration or not, but the setting of the ultra-wide stereo knob (when the knobs are set to the functions with that parameter) does not get stored.

Another important consideration is that the group setting for the knobs DOES get stored in a registration.  There are five groups (filter settings, reverb/chorus, envelope attack and release, style filter, and pan/ultra-wide stereo settings).  You probably know that you access these groups of functions by just repeatedly pressing the little white button by the knobs until the group you want is active, and you can tell which group is active by way of a set of numbered blocks displayed on  the screen.  So whichever group you select, that will be the one saved to a registration.  Depending on the group, it may not save the actual knob positions to a registration, but it will save the selection of what the knobs do.

This can be very useful.  Having the filter group be saved is often the most useful, because those knobs allow you to really alter the sound "on the fly" while playing a song.  For synthesizer type sounds, they work just like the low-pass filter settings on a synthesizer, and for organ sounds, they can go a long way toward simulating the drawbars of a Hammond-type organ by muffling and/or emphasizing certain frequencies of the sound.  Sometimes, when playing a song, I use the knobs (set to filter controls) to alter the sound during a song -- which can stretch out the capability of having only 32 registrations.  A little tip here is, let's say you playing a song and have a certain registration set up.  And now, let's say you want to alter the sound with the filter knobs for a section of the song.  Of course, you can adjust the filter knobs for that.  Now, after that, if you just want to go back to the original sound you had stored in the registration (before you started adjusting the filter controls), you can simply hit that registration button again, and it will bring up your original settings without having to adjust the knobs manually.

Sometimes, however, you may want one of the other groups of knob functions stored in a registration.  For example, with strings, you might want the envelope attack/release group saved.  This way, you can set a slow mellow attack, or a more abrupt sound, depending on the type of song you are playing.  And while the E433 does not have a panel "sustain" button, adjusting the release time gives you this function and allows you to determine how long notes will "ring on" after you let go of the keys, even without using a sustain pedal.  This does not apply to the split voice -- only the main and dual voices.

Finally, while the actual positions of the knobs may not get saved to registrations, some of the effects that they do actually do get stored.  For example, if you set up a sound using main and dual voices, then adjust the filter settings with the knobs to alter the sound, if you then save that sound in a registration, it will be saved with the filter settings that were generated internally based on your knob settings.  You can test this by setting up a sound (any sound), and then check the filter settings (often cutoff and resonance default at 64).  Now, adjust the filter knobs to alter the sound, and then save that new sound in a registration.  If you then call up this new registration and check the filter settings, you will likely find that they are no longer at their defaults and have been changed.  Curiously, however, these changes do not appear in the parameters until after you save the sound as a registration and then call it up again, even though you hear the changes right away.  Also, please note that the filter settings for the knobs affect the main and dual voices simultaneously, and do not affect the split voice at all.  If you want to change the filter settings of just the main or dual voice separately, you have to do it from the parameter list, as I described in my previous post.

Also remember that not all of the adjustments of all of the knob functions get saved in a registration.  For example, I know that the ultra-wide stereo setting will not get saved -- you can just adjust it the way you want, and then it will just stay how you set it as you change through different registrations.

I know this is a ton of information.  I just wanted to give you some more details on how this all works.  And like I said, depending on the kind of music you play, you can use my registrations as a starting point and see what you can do from there.  Go ahead and experiment with the filter, envelope, reverb, and chorus settings and see how much control you have over the sound to customize it the way you want.  And if you like what you did, save it in a registration!

Let me know if you have any questions.

[Mick47]

Thanks again. Everything I needed to know. I was wondering about the live control stuff but was seeing what I could achieve with the basics.
It seemed like a silly question but as your post shows it can get quite  complex. It makes me wonder what % of the capabilities of some keyboards are actually utilised by the purchaser's.
Ta very much.

[Mick47]

Have registered Orchestra strings sounds great. Just have to add drums tempo.
Hope you can still post the 1960s and Rock.

[SciNote]

Glad that those sounds are working well for you.  Yes, I'll post some rock and 60's registrations within a few days.  To keep this thread from getting cluttered, I'll start a new thread with those sounds.

[Mick47]

Okay Scinote..thanks again.