Extension USB cable

[Divemaster]

I searched for this subject and came up with a very long post on P24 of this section, but it hasn't been revisited for a long time, and some newer owners of the SX series may find the information useful.

Having owned many keyboards, some with USB ports at the front, (preferable) and some at the back (as on the SX series), you may well have come across the Yamaha instruction not to use extension leads in the USB port/s.

But many of us do, and never have any issues. So what's the problem? Why do we do it?

The reason is quite simple. The sockets are at the back and difficult to reach. Unless you can plug in your pen drive cleanly, you risk scratches, poor connection issues and maybe even shorting the socket and data loss.  You need to crane your neck round the keyboard to even see the USB, it's really not in an ideal place. More often that not you'll need to remove the music rest and music, pencils etc to get to it. That in itself is a real pain if you're say composing with sheet music.

Damaging a USB port is VERY expensive to get repaired. That's IF you can even get anyone to do the repair in the first place. I've had it happen once. The socket on my old Tyros just 'gave up working' one day. Quotes to repair it were just plain crazy, half the cost of the keyboard....and in the end I simply never used it again, fitted a hard drive and occasionally updated that direct from the pc using a simple readily availabe 2.5" IDE hard drive to USB cable.

I now use a high quality 8 inch USB male to female USB connector. This stays in the keyboard at all times, and is easily accessible from the side of the music rest. I can swap out USB pen drives very simply with no risk to the keyboard itself. A good well made cable.

I think the issue Yamaha are probably warning about is that if you use a LONGER cable, then obviously the risks of catching it on something, or tripping on it, or anything like that will, in all probability yank the socket with possibly expensive results to the keyboard USB.

So my own view is quite simple. I will continue to use my short cable. It's cable tied to my music rest on the keyboard, it's physically impossible to catch it on anything, but above all, it means that I am not wearing out the original instrument socket by constantly changing out pen drives.

The choice must be yours, but I have yet to have any issues with using a SHORT cable as described.

Might help some of you. 

[JohnS]

I use a 1 metre USB extension both front and back.
No problems.

[Toril S]

I also use it! Very convenient!

[EileenL]

Never has a problem with using one. Also use a little two inch one on fround p[ort of my Genos.  Save wear and Tear on the socket.

[bobn1944]

Me too
No problem

[TiasDad]

I use a splitter like this in my Sx900. I can plug two thumb drives in and still leave a socket free for powering ny midi controller keyboard

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/234078894185?_trkparms=amclksrc%3DITM%26aid%3D1110006%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.SIM%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D235843%26meid%3De521715d7e574ff5b716479d4b1da9ba%26pid%3D101195%26rk%3D2%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D323357168127%26itm%3D234078894185%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D0%26pg%3D2047675%26algv%3DSimplAMLv9PairwiseWebMskuAspectsV202110NoVariantSeed&_trksid=p2047675.c101195.m1851&amdata=cksum%3A234078894185e521715d7e574ff5b716479d4b1da9ba%7Cenc%3AAQAGAAACEECTmv6FpwoGOGJl411akUqUyweB60aI4kRbY6jvSood3BbncTsE7xx2%252BF5xWMcbthF9V9RK4OCk8sPEk3WoxHM4GyWWV4OGqo1oDRvXb9EUMNjHMXx5KaWcOkxogFPoDBwPC1wvHZAcJg1N9EwX%252Fk3FUAoUeTGWV6CvjLBTll34tP067ACHFMziq4b8cEyl82uPhBkA%252F3Jk8x%252F4qqmXhCdOg4DpGg5NFxRqFOwXVvoHS%252Bfh30Z9VXH4D0ymrUNVIM7lMCEi5JSAhBH5pfb442ms1U3QVPzAuq5D181M%252FsScosf1qXJiKWW7wEU0XzEoYBwtyfvldDmmS6YK0JVjpJpuF6D9N3exlhX3yN8iApInEN6AltLvavsjdNG5CJkm2barA9mOagdGZ4V8ALjvyE9AMXXa9hz1ExpWqiU1TM0Z04qjsDxY2p1TR2Ah2pDkOsBz5Fp3UMfsmQgmmJTsR8004OHbm6DVt7kvXWxuzRILabXOvr1OQoJY9DgIj22pfrztFSXYWvMNAvqjqytqF04%252FW9cDE5cDSwolfpWw65Xdw5TidakH%252FvjQuX9zZfIyC1fSLRvKPDpLAPYEDxhKSI%252FN3mHZdSrh5VxXRAEpRAiUejF5QC0Xx5QvWQE9%252BsohzH%252BJ0JobjPo%252FWUJusZLiOqMu6wiyqr4aPx8LTBotn1OjEehjWfgpRqRO40TSFBfwZg%253D%253D%7Campid%3APL_CLK%7Cclp%3A2047675

[jcm2016]

@Tiasdad - how does the keyboard interpret two USBs going in to a split cable?  Are they USB1 and USB2?  Then if you have something in the second socket on the keyboard is that USB3?  Thanks

[johan]

With a usb split cable, you only have one data usb connection (= the orginal one), the other one is only for power supply.

[meyrick]

Hi.
I use a powered USB 3 with my SX900. With four switchable sockets I don't have to bother with fiddling at the back of the keyboard.

[attachment deleted by admin]

[sjn2048]

I've installed a Targus powered 7 port USB2 Hub on my friends PSR Sx900 and it recognises two USB pens at the same time as USB1 and USB2 without any problems. Haven't tried it with more than two pens. No need to switch between them on the hub.

[TiasDad]

@Tiasdad - how does the keyboard interpret two USBs going in to a split cable?  Are they USB1 and USB2?  Then if you have something in the second socket on the keyboard is that USB3?  Thanks

Tbh, I've never really looked properly. The two thumb drives show up as USB1 and USB2 and I don't think the midi controller is recognised as a drive, It just uses the power supply. I have tried it with one drive in the extension with the controller and the other drive in the USB2 socket and it makes no difference but it's easier having access to both drives via the extension

[Joe H]

I've always used an extension cable with a 4-port USB HUB with switches on it. That way I can turn either pen drive on or both at the same time.

Joe H

[BOAC]

I use these, never had a problem and you can stick them to the top surface or their own weight will hold them anyway.
https://www.startech.com/en-gb/cables/usbextaa5dsk
Cheers

[pjd]

Having owned many keyboards, some with USB ports at the front, (preferable) and some at the back (as on the SX series), you may well have come across the Yamaha instruction not to use extension leads in the USB port/s.

But many of us do, and never have any issues. So what's the problem? Why do we do it?

Yamaha has some of the most conservative hardware engineers (and lawyers) on Planet Earth. 

There are for-real limits on USB cable length: USB 2.0 is 5M, USB3.0 is 3M.

Most of us use extension cables which are much shorter and have no problems. I like 12" extenders and I use them with musical instrument keyboards and personal computers.

Why? I got burned by the absolutely lousy USB port design in an Apple Macbook Air. They wanted to replace -- and charge me for -- the main logic board to the tune of $600USD. As a retired engineer, I stood my ground as to the cheap-o design that was a failure waiting to happen. That experience plus overheating problems, and I won't touch another Apple Macbook Air ever.

I also try to reduce wear and tear on the USB connector itself. This is especially important on my PC as I do a lot of insertion and removal during the course of a day. Eventually, the connector traces will fail...

Stuff just wears out. I'm 69 and worn out. 

-- pj

[Joe H]

...  Stuff just wears out. I'm 69 and worn out. 

-- pj

Just wait another 5 or 6 years!

   

Joe H

[dlepera]

Just saw this post and let me add what works well for me.  I have Atolla(from Amazon) with an AC adaptor and 4 USB ports that you can turn off and on at will.  My sx700 does in fact recognize all four USBs when they are all turned at once, accesses them and I can manipulate files with no problem.  In fact initially to prove it I put a file with the same name on all my USBs. Turned the ports all on at once, the keyboard recognized & displayed them(usb1,usb2,usb3,usb4) in addition to the resident USER memory.

  This eliminates and wear and tear concerns that one may have on the keyboard port(s).

Great for keeping things organized, moving things from one USB stick to another without the use of my computer, but have to caution that you need to be careful where you save to ensure that everything for a registration bank for example is on the usb that you are saving it on(sytles, voices, pads) from what I have read when trying organize on one USB and moving files around.

    I have not tried it yet as I just got this though, but, since the search can identify all the files I am looking for and they all play well from any location(as I flip from one usb to the other), I am wondering if the keyboard is smart enough to search for sytles for example located on the originating usb stick folder when the Bank was saved, then I move that folder in it's entirety leaving the Bank file on USB1???  Everything that I have read states that all the BANK components must reside on the Root USB(in the ""original folder"" location).  Have not seen anything that states that the FOLDER has to be in the root of the same USB.

      Will try this as I find time and get 4 different USBs so that I don't accidently mess up my live ones just in case.  Unless someone has an answer to this already. 
                     
                               dom

[overover]

Hi Dom,

Note that the order of the USB sticks (USB 1, 2, 3, 4) can change randomly if more than one stick is connected when the keyboard is started or if a USB hub with several active sticks is connected.

Basically it doesn't matter where a Registration Bank file is saved or from where it is called up. It is only important that the files linked in the registrations (e.g. User Styles, User Multi Pads, MIDI files) are not moved or renamed afterwards. Of course, this also applies to the folders that contain such files. Since the absolute path to the linked files is saved in the registrations (including the internal drive letter), it is important that the USB stick in question is always addressed with the same drive letter.

USB #  =  Internal drive letter
USB 1  =  I:
USB 2  =  J:
USB 3  =  K:
USB 4  =  L:

It is easiest if only one USB stick is connected. This is then always automatically USB 1 (= drive letter I: ). If several sticks are connected, I recommend that you make sure that the "main stick" is addressed as USB 1. The best thing to do is to copy all the files required for registrations to this "main stick" and then reload them from there before using them in registrations.


P.S.
In certain cases, the GENOS searches for required files on all connected USB drives, regardless of which drive letter they are currently being addressed with. I don't know how the SX models behave in this regard. However, it is best to bypass the whole thing from the start by making sure, as I said, that only files that are on USB 1 / drive letter I: are used in registrations.


Best regards,
Chris

[dlepera]

Good information and advice.  Well noted... Thank you Chris.
                   
                               dom

[jcm2016]

What is the advantage of using sticks instead of saving to the User drive?   Is it simply space - when you have lots of registrations you run out of space in the User drive?   This is my first arranger and I haven't had it that long, so I'm not feeling a space crunch (yet).   Thanks

[jtrue]

To me there are two major convenience benefits:  By storing all performance-related files on a USB stick the entire product of many hours of preparation can be backed up quickly, easily and cheaply to several other sticks via a PC.  Secondarily, if unable to use my own instrument I can bring all my prepared material to another instrument in moments on an easily transported medium.

    j.

[andres_fprado]

Hi, jcm!

Today, it's mostly moot. It does have a few advantages: portability, ease of back-up, possibility to have different sticks tailored to different situations, like already mentioned by jtrue.

But in previous models, the user space was very restricted! I now have a PSR-SX900, with its 4GB user drive. But my previous keyboard was a PSR-S750, and the user drive had 1.9 MB (Mega bytes!) That's definitely not a lot! Therefore, you needed to have an external stick to hold anything useful. In my case, the only thing I had in the user drive was a basic Registration to reset the keyboard to known settings. This accustomed many of us to use almost exclusively sticks for our content.

Today, unless you are recording in audio format (WAV), the user drive should be more than enough for most uses. If you need to record audio, you should at least consider using an external stick, because the files get big very fast.

Regards!

[jcm2016]

Thanks for the explanation

[TiasDad]

I prefer using a usb stick as I also do a fair bit of editing of styles in external programs.
I find it so much easier moving the usb stick to the pc for this and then back again once complete

[Digital Gee]

Fairly new member here - this might be my first post! I just had to say I was soooo excited to get this tip of using an extender. I'd been saying to my better half the only fault I've found so far in a couple of weeks of using the SX900 was how they designed the USB port in the BACK of the instrument. Made no sense to me.

Never occurred to me to use an extender. Then I saw this thread and voila! Ordered one two nights ago, and Amazon brought it today.

Genius! Pure genius!

Gary

[overover]

Fairly new member here - this might be my first post! ...

Gary

Welcome to the PSR Tutorial Forum, Gary!

I wish you lots of fun and joy with your new PSR-SX900!


Best regards.
Chris