Genos Chord Cancel A#BC (etc)

dh110953 · March 17, 2021, 11:30:27 AM

I stumbled across a great feature when I misplayed a chord recently (yes! it happens) - This was Cancel Chord function, for example pressing A# B C at the same time cancels the chord accompaniment but leaves the backing drums (rhythm) still playing - this is a great feature and used appropriately adds extra dimensions to my playing. HOWEVER, is there any way to remove/prevent the Cymbal Crash that plays when these 3 consecutive keys are pressed - I would just like to be able to pause the accompaniment without a Cymbal Crash confirming I have cancelled a chord.

I know I can assign a pedal to do some of this (Synch Start/Stop) and I could also press the Synch Start/Stop button but these cancel the chord and the rhythm (drums).

So, does anyone know of a way I can cancel the Cymbal Crash or perhaps if not, this may be something that Yamaha may consider for a future firmware update.

overover · March 17, 2021, 12:12:31 PM

Hi dh110953,

while playing with complete accompaniment,, you can simply turn off the ACMP button (only for a very short time) and then switch it on again immediately.

Then only the drums will be heard. The complete accompaniment will come back when you play the next chord.

You could also use Registrations to temporarily switch off certain Style Parts.

Best regards,
Chris

Toril S · March 17, 2021, 12:24:30 PM

These crash cymbals can be very annoying!

Lee Batchelor · March 17, 2021, 02:53:44 PM

In my years of playing on live stage, i've heard that crash on occasion, not knowing what it was. It was my clumsiness when switching chords. I never knew it was also a shortcut for turning off the rhythm

.

Yes, please Yamaha - turn off the cymbal crash!!! I don't need your help to show my clumsiness!!! Without the cymbal crash, no one would even notice my dischord.

JohnS (Ugawoga) · March 17, 2021, 04:33:37 PM

Quote from: dh110953 on March 17, 2021, 11:30:27 AM
I stumbled across a great feature when I misplayed a chord recently (yes! it happens) - This was Cancel Chord function, for example pressing A# B C at the same time cancels the chord accompaniment but leaves the backing drums (rhythm) still playing - this is a great feature and used appropriately adds extra dimensions to my playing. HOWEVER, is there any way to remove/prevent the Cymbal Crash that plays when these 3 consecutive keys are pressed - I would just like to be able to pause the accompaniment without a Cymbal Crash confirming I have cancelled a chord.

I know I can assign a pedal to do some of this (Synch Start/Stop) and I could also press the Synch Start/Stop button but these cancel the chord and the rhythm (drums).

So, does anyone know of a way I can cancel the Cymbal Crash or perhaps if not, this may be something that Yamaha may consider for a future firmware update.

Press any three keys together does the same, all next to each other.
I agree that annoying cymbol does happen when you do it.

vanzee · March 18, 2021, 05:40:13 AM

I also find that "Cymbal Crash" is usually disturbing.
In midi files I remove this in the drum track via XGworks> Piano Roll.
I have never tried it, maybe it also works in "Style"?

overover · March 18, 2021, 05:52:18 AM

Quote from: Lee Batchelor on March 17, 2021, 02:53:44 PM
In my years of playing on live stage, i've heard that crash on occasion, not knowing what it was. It was my clumsiness when switching chords. I never knew it was also a shortcut for turning off the rhythm .

Yes, please Yamaha - turn off the cymbal crash!!! I don't need your help to show my clumsiness!!! Without the cymbal crash, no one would even notice my dischord.

Hi Lee,

you could use the "Multi Finger" fingering type (instead of "Fingered" or "AI Fingered"). Then the "Chord Cancel" shortcuts (playing 3 or 4 keys next to each other) do not work, and you would not get any Crash cymbals by accident.

Best regards,
Chris

Lee Batchelor · March 18, 2021, 07:09:49 AM

Thanks for the work-around and explanations, guys. For the longest time, I thought I was going crazy...well that's another topic

. I'm just glad my Genos isn't broken, but rather, the product of a Yamaha engineer who has a sick sense of humor.

Fred Smith · March 18, 2021, 07:12:26 AM

Quote from: dh110953 on March 17, 2021, 11:30:27 AM

So, does anyone know of a way I can cancel the Cymbal Crash or perhaps if not, this may be something that Yamaha may consider for a future firmware update.

If the left voice is off, there is no cymbal crash.

This is the way I set up my voices, as I want the left hand to only control the style.

Cheers,
Fred

Lee Batchelor · March 18, 2021, 07:13:51 AM

It's that simple? Good to hear because that is something we can store in a Registration. Thanks, Fred!

overover · March 18, 2021, 08:45:57 AM

Quote from: Fred Smith on March 18, 2021, 07:12:26 AM
If the left voice is off, there is no cymbal crash.

This is the way I set up my voices, as I want the left hand to only control the style. ...

Hi Fred,

I can't quite believe that this has anything to do with whether the Left Part is on or off.

The mentioned function "Chord Cancel" basically has nothing to do with the Left Voice, but with the STYLE: By playing 3 keys next to each other all Style Parts are muted except the Drums, and if you play 4 keys next to each other you can hear only Drums & Bass. And this is always initiated with a Crash cymbal strike, which apparently some users do not like.

By the way: Which fingering type do you normally use? If you use "Multi Finger", then this is the reason that the "Chord Cancel" feature does not work.

P.S.
Personally, I consider the two "Chord Cancel" variants (including the crash cymbals) to be a welcome variety in live performances. (Most live drummers play much more crashes ...

)

Best regards,
Chris

Fred Smith · March 18, 2021, 10:32:20 AM

Quote from: overover on March 18, 2021, 08:45:57 AM
I can't quite believe that this has anything to do with whether the Left Part is on or off.

The mentioned function "Chord Cancel" basically has nothing to do with the Left Voice, but with the STYLE: By playing 3 keys next to each other all Style Parts are muted except the Drums, and if you play 4 keys next to each other you can hear only Drums & Bass. And this is always initiated with a Crash cymbal strike, which apparently some users do not like.

By the way: Which fingering type do you normally use? If you use "Multi Finger", then this is the reason that the "Chord Cancel" feature does not work.

Hi Chris,

I use multi-finger exclusively, never use a left voice, and use the cancel chord feature occasionally. I don't remember ever having a cymbal crash when I used the cancel chord. However, as I've said before, I don't have my keyboard with me due to the Canada/US border closure, so can't test it out. I'll have to leave the testing to someone lucky enough to have their keyboard with them.

Cheers,
Fred

Jørgen · March 18, 2021, 11:40:47 AM

Hi

More about the 3 and 4 fingers trick at
http://www.jososoft.dk/yamaha/articles/style2_10.htm

Regards
Jørgen

overover · March 18, 2021, 12:16:14 PM

Quote from: Fred Smith on March 18, 2021, 10:32:20 AM
Hi Chris,

I use multi-finger exclusively, never use a left voice, and use the cancel chord feature occasionally. I don't remember ever having a cymbal crash when I used the cancel chord. However, as I've said before, I don't have my keyboard with me due to the Canada/US border closure, so can't test it out. I'll have to leave the testing to someone lucky enough to have their keyboard with them. ...

Thanks for your quick feedback, Fred!

As already mentioned, these 3 or 4 fingers "tricks" do not work with the "Multi Finger" setting (and of course not with "Single Finger" either), but only with the various "Fingered" settings.

Best regards,
Chris

maartenb · March 19, 2021, 09:55:35 AM

I'd love to have the ability to turn the Cymbal Crash off!

I play in AI Fingered mode and too often get an unintended Cymbal Crash with 5-finger chords, like G/A for example. Especially with ballads the unintended Crash feels out of place.

I hope Yamaha will add this in a next firmware update.

Maarten