Spicing up your styles

[Henni]

Found this at SynthZone and tried it on my S770 - the results are truly AMAZING!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xMiGEQE_7eU

"amazing things start to happen when you
DIG IN the OS of any keyboard wow!
why be stuck with the sound the factory gives you.
Put in the time do your homework .....sound amazing!"

[Pino]

Yes Henni, you are correct,
It's all there, just need the time to 'DIG IN'

I have been studying styles the past few months
Now making nice song styles from MIDI

Pino

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[Henni]

For those who do not understand:

In the drum sections of the Yamaha style, you can split your drum kit up in selected sections of any available drumkit. I.o.w. say you choose a Kick from the Rock set, there are three different Kick drums available just in that kit, many more in the other kits. Select any of them. Next you can grab a snare from the Symphony kit. There are mostly ten or more selections available under most categories. Now grab a Hi-hat from somewhere. Same goes for the Toms and for EVERY individual instrument that makes up for your total drum kit.

Next, adjust the individual vollumes, attack, effect and many more parameters individually for every single one of these selected drum parts.

Can you imagine what is possible? I never knew this. It is really AMAZING to say the least.

[andyg]

The possibilities are indeed almost endless, but this is probably way beyond what most home players will ever want to do. Remember that a good number of them only use Music Finder, OTS and Playlists for their sounds! But neverthless it's good to know that this flexibility is there for those who do want to attack it, though!  Thanks for sharing, but how about a little video tutorial to tempt people to have a go?

FWIW, for those who might be be a little wary of going that far, you can do some simpler spicing up just by going to the Mixer and altering the instrumentation and balance of the styles. Save as a new style or as part of a registration.

And, as I was showing someone just last night, you don't have to stick to just one style in a song. You can use a mix of similar (or perhaps even dissimilar) styles. Just make sure that the tempo doesn't change and, by going to the mixer, that the drum kit and bass sounds in particular remain the same, with the same sort of balance.

[DrakeM]

This video only shows how to do this sort of thing with a Genos keyboard. It looks like the Genos keyboard as an added a MULTI button (as well as a SINGLE) on their screen to change all the volume settings for the selected drum part at one time. My S950 only allows SINGLE changes, so I have to reduce each drum hit occurrence one at a time. Generally with Yamaha styles they are only 4 measures long and this process still only takes about 30 - 45 seconds to do.

I don't believe you can save your changes made in this way to the style in a registration, you probably have save these changes as a NEW style and then name it and save it to your USB stick.

This process is something I have been doing for years and it is the first step I do when creating each of my own custom song styles. You have to first find the correct drum pattern for the song you are working towards creating. Just about every pattern you can think of is already included with your keyboard or it is in our archived of oldies styles. The second step is to then find the correct Bass pattern for your song style creation.

Regards
Drake

[DerekA]

The S770, S970, S775, S975 and Genos can all do this trick, through the Drum Setup feature.

I expect this is done through adding SY*** messages to the style. It would be interesting to see if an earlier keyboard (including T5) responded to those messages. Can someone post such a modified style so we can try?

[ckobu]

DerekA,  all yamaha arranger models respond to sy*** data (4,36 sec). You can do this also with XGWorks on any Yamaha Style (after 2,31 sec).
Look at my video.

https://youtu.be/xK1pCUyJg8o

[beykock]

Ckobu,

I am very grateful for your demonstration. Very interesting and very useful video.

Many thanks, B

[DerekA]

DerekA,  all yamaha arranger models respond to sy*** data (4,36 sec). You can do this also with XGWorks on any Yamaha Style (after 2,31 sec).
Look at my video.

https://youtu.be/xK1pCUyJg8o

As far as I can see ckobu, in this video you're changing parameters such as filter, resonance and pan for an individual drum sound. The newer keyboards can mix'n'match between drum kits - selecting a bass from one kit, snare from another, hat from something else etc. Do you know if the older keyboards respond to the SY*** to make that happen?

[ckobu]

Sy*** only works on the characteristics of a sound, such as a snare, cymbal... Sy*** does not interfere with the combination of drum elements of different drum kits. There is no such thing as an older keyboard, and we can only create the CUSTOM DRUM that we put into Style.
The ability to combine elements from different drum kits only has PSR S770, 970, 775, 975 and Genos.

[DerekA]

I agree that the newer keyboards do it, but I am interested to know *how* they do it.

If you can save the changes in a style, then it must be putting something into the style file.

I had a look in the data manual for the S975, and there is a table titled "MIDI Parameter Change table (DRUM SETUP)" which includes the messages to set up the source drum kit and note. So I do believe that it's done using SY***. By 'older' keyboard I mean anything pre-Sx70 generation. I wonder if they respond to these messages, though they are not documented in their data manuals.

[XeeniX]

Looks interesting so thank you for sharing and for the effort put into creating this video. I for one though rather use mixmaster from Michael/Etienne Much more versatile when finetuning a style/drummapping. Although not that easy at first either, it still beats style creator by miles looking at the learning curve and the possibilities. Especially when you own a Tyros and not being able to do this as the creator mentioned in the beginning

regards,
Peter

[Pino]

Hi Ckobu,
Thats a great video you made there.
I'm  spending hours tuning my song styles on the keyboard
This video sure makes it look easier working on the PC
I'm using StyleMagic but I don't think we have that level of editing
or maybe I have to study SM more.

I have MixMaster, -  Is XG works still available?

Pino

UPDATE
I'm looking at MidiWorks from MidiSoft right now
Seems to have what missing in StyleMagic

[Joe H]

For those who do not understand:

In the drum sections of the Yamaha style, you can split your drum kit up in selected sections of any available drumkit.I.o.w. say you choose a Kick from the Rock set, there are three different Kick drums available just in that kit, many more in the other kits. Select any of them. Next you can grab a snare from the Symphony kit. There are mostly ten or more selections available under most categories. Now grab a Hi-hat from somewhere. Same goes for the Toms and for EVERY individual instrument that makes up for your total drum kit.

Next, adjust the individual vollumes, attack, effect and many more parameters individually for every single one of these selected drum parts.

Can you imagine what is possible? I never knew this. It is really AMAZING to say the least.

Actually StyleMagic has an excellent Drum Editor that allows us to "tune" each drum / percussion sound to our own liking and gives the same results as you describe.  By tuning the individual drum sounds, we can make the drum kit sound totally different.  Parameters for each drum note include: Fine Tune, Filter, Resonance, Volume, Reverb, Attack, Decay1, Decay2.



Joe H

[Pino]

Thanks Joe, I'll take a look at it again,

I find that Song Creator does eventually get reasonable results
But editing over the keyboard for long periods can give one a bad back
Editing on the PC has got to be better

I'm trying to spend my time playing music rather than editing.
It takes so much time to get things right and it will never be perfect.

I've successfully made some song styles recently,
I'll put some up here later

Pino

[ckobu]

I agree that the newer keyboards do it, but I am interested to know *how* they do it.

If you can save the changes in a style, then it must be putting something into the style file.

I had a look in the data manual for the S975, and there is a table titled "MIDI Parameter Change table (DRUM SETUP)" which includes the messages to set up the source drum kit and note. So I do believe that it's done using SY***. By 'older' keyboard I mean anything pre-Sx70 generation. I wonder if they respond to these messages, though they are not documented in their data manuals.

DerekA, you're probably right. The drum element change is changed through syex data.
I test with one style on my Genos. I changed Power snare with Rock snare and I can see new string Sy***.
Sy***=F0 43 10 4C 30 26 70 7F 00 5A 26 F7  Ch 10 Drum Edit Note#
But, I think that this control can't read in the "old keyboard".

...
I have MixMaster, -  Is XG works still available?

....

Pino, XGWorks is old program that has stopped updating 2002.y. I do not know if legally here is a download link. Incidentally, XGWorks also works properly on the Win10 system.

[PierreSW]

Hey!
I have XGWORKS installed in an old XP computer,
How do I do to install XGWORKS in Win10?
I have the program on a CD with code and everything I bought in my music store
Greetings Pierre

[RF]

The S770, S970, S775, S975 and Genos can all do this trick, through the Drum Setup feature.

I expect this is done through adding SY*** messages to the style. It would be interesting to see if an earlier keyboard (including T5) responded to those messages. Can someone post such a modified style so we can try?

I used the Drum Setup feature, connected via MIDI another keyboard on the Yamaha and played from this on the modified style. I noticed, that the style editor created a new drum kit, this will be saved with the style.

[Wim NL]

How about when select a drum kit by press and hold,
there appear a yellow stripe left of the drum kit.

There must be a way to create a custom drumkit without a style.

[ckobu]

Hey!
I have XGWORKS installed in an old XP computer,
How do I do to install XGWORKS in Win10?
I have the program on a CD with code and everything I bought in my music store
Greetings Pierre

It is very simple. You must copy/paste instalation folder from XP anywhere on computer with Win10. Run XGWorks with XGWorks.exe file. 
XGWorks works without special installation.

[PierreSW]

Thanks so much!
It works with XG Works in Win10 now. 
Could not install from CD. Perhaps too old with Win 95/98 program in Win 10.
// Pierre

[Joe H]

Thanks so much!
It works with XG Works in Win10 now. 
Could not install from CD. Perhaps too old with Win 95/98 program in Win 10.
// Pierre

Yes,

XGWorks is portable.  You can copy the entire (installed) XG folder from your XP machine to Win7 or Win10 then create a shortcut and drag it to the desktop.  It will run just fine and so will any plug-ins.

Joe H