midi files

[mikf]

It does actually say in the user manual page 68 I think that you can play along with midi files but doesn't  tell you how to do it.

The reason they don't tell you how to do it is because there is really nothing to tell. You just turn on the midi and start playing.  Its hard to figure out from what you are posting why you are having trouble with this. Of course you need to have voices activated across both hands or there will be no sound.
Mike

[jcl123]

hello Mike
thanks for replying I am obviously not explaining myself very clearly my midifiles atm are on usb so I select song, tab across to usb, select the midi file press play/pause in the song section and the midi will play all the way through the song and I can watch the score as the the ball bounces along  passing the chords and the notes as it progresses to the end of the song and then stops playing.

what I would like to do (but don't think can be done) is to switch off (mute) the chords and the melody voice from the midifile then after doing so select the same midifile again in the song section switch on the score then press play/pause in the song section I would assume the midi would then start to play the intro and when the score shows the bar where the chords and music starts I would play those parts I have switched off (muted) myself on the keyboard,  so basically the midi file is working as a backing track or style whichever you want to call it
regards jcl 

[mikf]

Now it is clear what you are doing - and the short answer is that it cannot be done.
You need to understand how your arranger functions to produce the auto accompaniment. The auto accompaniment on your keyboard is enabled by a style file. The midi files which you have cannot behave like a style.
Strictly speaking midi is just a standard data format that can be used to store, and move data between devices and is used for multiple things.  But when people colloquially refer to a file as a 'midi' they typically mean a piece of music stored in a midi digital format file.
The auto accompaniment files we call style files may use also midi format to communicate, but we never refer to them as 'midis'.
Mike

[jcl123]

thanks Mike
What about song styles I assume that whatever song is on there will be as near as possible to the original artist recording and they will basically be plug in and play usb and probably include intro/endings and ots. do they have score as well? seen them on that well known selling site but you can't sample them till you actually receive them. If they don'tcome with the score functio then obviously I would have to purchase the sheet music. Also the music finder there is plenty of songs on there but again  no sheet music.
regards jcl

[mikf]

Song specific styles are sometimes very good. But in many cases the song named style is nothing more than a standard style which has been slightly modified to make it suitable for the song, rather than fully customized to make a cover of the song. For example they may have only set the tempo to suit that song, or maybe a modified OTS to get lead voices they thought suitable. I am not saying this is bad, because I am not myself a huge fan of exact covers, playing your own version of a song can be just as enjoyable.
Mostly the song styles you buy from reputable sources should be good, but can be expensive because a highly individual style is a lot of work to compile.
There are a vast number of free styles on this forum, but it takes a lot of sifting through to find good ones. At the early stages, it is often best to just use the playlist or musicfinder provided on the keyboard. You can drive yourself crazy by amassing massive amounts of style files. Then it becomes like those screws and nails you always save, but it is so hard to find the right one  when you need it years later, that you end up going to the store and buying new ones. Maybe later you can look at custom styles. I almost never use anything except standard styles, and I think I can make pretty good music!
As regards sheet music, you don't really want sheet music to play the arranger. You want what we call lead sheets. These are simple to read, and contain melody and chords. You can often get a lead sheet for a song on the forum just by asking if someone has one. Unless it is a very rare song, most times someone will post one. Then you can print or download. Take the Elvis song you mentioned, I would bet someone would post a lead sheet if you asked inside a few hours. 
There are books called fake books which contain huge collections of lead sheets. Nearly all musicians have these, and you maybe should get one or two. The one called the Real Fake Book for example has hundreds of popular songs. And you can get them in various genres - broadway shows, pop, etc etc. Many of these have also been posted on the forum, although you may have to become a senior member to access them.
Mike 

[jcl123]

Thanks Mike
I do have quite a substantial amount of music and I can read it in quite a few keys in the easy keys I just slow it down till it sounds OK then play it at the correct speed, the music with more difficult key signatures takes a little longer but I just slow it down and practice and I soon get there. I have a roland G800 arranger workstation and this has 128 styles 689 voices 192 performance memories and I only play at home for enjoyment so what I might do is sell the tyros and just stick with my Roland G800 because with the tyros I'm spending hours on end just to find the right  styles for the song and to set it all up and by the time I've done all that I feel to knackered to play it so it becomes a chore instead of an enjoyment.
Thanks for your help anyway Mike

[Toril S]

Oh no, don't even think of selling your Tyros! If you can live with reading your sheet music from paper, you don't have to set ut the Tyros at all, just select a style, use the OTS and play! It doesn't have to be complicated. I have a Tyros5 and a Genos, and use them with almost no eyesight. You have a fantastic instrument in that Tyros, take your time to know it, and you will love it, mark my words!

[jcl123]

thanks Toril for the advice but the Roland keyboard I have is not as complicated as the tyros and it's the same type of keyboard Arranger workstation same sort of things on the roland as the tyros, 76 key 3 split points 4 intros/ endings /variations  128 music styles 689 sounds
192 performance memories. I have been a little bit disappointed  with the tyros since I bought it I really don't see the point in having almost 2000 songs in the music finder and not having the music to play them, would have been much better if they would have put the music for these songs on the score instead of using it for midi files which the majority of players probably won't use anyway. I will more than likely buy another keyboard when I have sold my tyros but it won't be a yamaha might buy another Roland I will make sure I do my homework before I buy another
Regards
jcl

[panos]

Hi again Fred,
A midi file or a midi song has 16 channels that can all of them play simultaneously.
Τhat means 16 "hands" are playing several organs to have a nice result.
As long as we have just two hands, we have to mute some channels of the midi to play along with our right and left hand.

The video below shows all the organs a midi can have(except from the drums):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-gG_4Uq4fU

The organs(channels) that play the melody line have to be muted so we can play the melody.
So we have to mute the strings which usually play the left hand chords.
We can leave all the rest as they are (the bass and the other organs will still play notes on the set chords/harmonies and some other little riffs).

That is what people are doing with midi files to play along.
How many organs(channels) has to be to muted in every different midi is the user's choice.

On the other hand with a style the user "tells" all the organs(style parts/channels or multipads) what notes they should play by hitting the right chords.
There is no keyboard that can provide preset specific song styles because there are millions of songs and many many genres of music.

For each song we want to play with a style, either we use a preset one, either we search our usb's if there is any, either we ask on the forum, either we buy one, either we create one from scratch or modify an existing one to match better to the song.
The song is the notes and the chords we are playing, not the style itself.

[mikf]

JCL
Fake books and lead sheets are so cheap ( often free) and available that no one would buy midis just to get the score. I think you are thinking of things he wrong way round. If you can only play by music, you open your fake book at a song you want to play, then find a style and play. Why do you want the score on the screen. Its better on paper. That linked score thing Yamaha give is just a learning tool You dont need that I see it as a bit of a pest really because now it is in the way of anything else you want to change on the screen.
Mike

[jcl123]

thanks Mike and Panos
Panos for explaining midi files in detail and about all the channels that operate them.

Mike for the encouragement,  I had a look today Mike at lead sheets and fake books that you mentioned and don't think I would gain anything
purchasing them I do have a lot of music books the majority are Rodger Evans and Kenneth baker so a big mixture of songs I must have about 500 songs in total possibly more and all written in different keys I don't really want to be playing  everything in c major.  chords and reading music is not really a big problem for me its just setting up the styles and voices splitting the the keyboard intros endings fill ins then saving to music finder, the registration buttons I use just for voices so if the voice in the song gets a bit boring whilst playing its easy to change it.
had a couple of hours on the tyros today so I think I'll persevere for while and see how I get on. there's not much point in trying to sell it anyway atm because we are in complete lockdown here in the uk. 
thanks regards jcl

[Toril S]

Glad you came to your senses😀😀 LOL😀  I see that chords and reading music is no problem for you. So then it makes much more sense to use styles.. The Tyros will grow on you, it is a really good instrument.

[jcl123]

Thanks Toril
Yes but plenty of headache tablets taking that many I can almost rattle in time to the music.

Regards
jcl

[Toril S]

The Headache Tablet Rattle. Good title for my next composition, on the TYROS It gave me headaches at first too, but now it gives only joy. That doesn't say that I can use all its features, just that I can use the features I like to use the most Always start easy with a keyboard from another brand, the operating system is different, and that takes some time getting used to. Find a score, find a style that you think fits the song, and play! All the extra mumbo jumpo comes later! Good luck with your wonderful T5! I have one too, 61 notes.

[jcl123]

Hello Toril
Yes I know what you mean this T5 I have is a 76 key makes it useful for splitting the keyboard into 3 gives a me a few more options
my Roland is the same 76key quite a few songs I have in that are split 3 ways on the keyboard gives a lot more options when playing.

talking about midi files I have just noticed there is almost 700 views on this post must be quite a lot of players interest in midis
regards
jcl 

[AndyT]

Hi JCL,

Some thoughts.....

If there is a good style I will use that, but some midis have so many changes and effects that can take playing to the next level. However, some would say "you are then in a straight jacket - always playing the same piece the same way more or less". I don't totally agree as that is exactly what playing along with a style is The benefits for "My Way" for example are the gradual volume increase and build up part way through. You can't do that without a lot of fiddling or volume pedal etc. Extra instruments and drums come in - so you would need to code up multipads. So then you open up a whole new world.

I like playing along with midi files - for a few of the songs. Finding a good one is the first step. I like to have the words and chords on screen. Chords are midi events and sometimes when you edit a midi on a PC they can get stripped out. PSRUTI is great at guessing them and then if there are any corrections, they are easy to see and make (on a PC!) You can also add text/reminders to change REG or something like that. This gives some consistency. Some midis you can play along to a style which then overwrites or appends to the midi depending on what tracks are in use. Sometimes the combination of midi and style can sound stunning - sometimes not.

Why edit midis - cause many of them are not all on track one, or not all of the melody is on track 1. So you are part way through a midi and you can't see the melody notes. That means you need to copy them from one track to another. So let's say the main melody is on track 1 and then on track 11. Oh yes, some midis make finding the melody a challenge You copy the relevant section from track 11 to track 1.

The next problem is getting sheet music that matches the midi. I sometimes do that as it is easier to see what is coming up and exactly where you are in the music. "Let Me Entertain You" by Robbie Williams is an excellent example. I ended up colour coding some of the changes, repeats. loops etc and I now enjoy the technical side as my playing is impeded a bit for other reasons. The other thing is that you will rarely get the music in the exact same key with all the same key changes as in the midi. So you have programs like notation composer £££ or musescore (Free!) and there are probably others. The first can create a fake book lead sheet very quickly and you can copy across tracks, but costs way too much. You can do the same in musescore (import midi etc) and then hide the instruments you don't want. There is a chordfinder plugin which is quite good at guessing the chords. I think it is stunning, but steep learning curve. The print outs are better than notation comp. imho.

The next stage is turning off channel 1 and/or other channels (you mentioned the chords)- well that is only 1 option. So for example, if there is some timing that you are not sure of, then sometimes it is better to change the melody instrument to flute or clarinet and set the volume to 30. In other words something that you can just hear if you are not playing anything else. MixMaster is quite good for that. You can still switch the channel off on the Tyros if you want to, but that sometimes helps. Also you can change to string  and put lots of echo on, which again can be interesting.

So to your point of switching off the chords. Typically backing will be split across many channels and you can switch them all off if you personally want to play the chords. This can also be interesting if you have a Jazz piece such as Fly Me To The Moon as that will have a few chord alternatives and you might want to play differently. I have never seen that on Yamaha  or any other midi, but again it is something you could add as text with PSRUTI. I keep mentioning that as it is one of the few programs that doesn't screw up midi files and I won't mention the ones that do.

One trick that you might be missing as you mention splitting the keyboard is that you can do that with registration changes and then assign those changes to a foot pedal. So sometimes I get a bit lost when playing stuff in the "third sector" so I will reg shift the keyboard on a foot pedal to make the sound changes in "2nd sector" and then reg shift again to reset it back. It gets more interesting than that as you can set up a "registration sequence" (should be in the manual) and then completely change the keyboard setup in each of the sectors when you shift change registrations. So, you can have loads of changes within one song or melody.

Hope all this makes sense and helps. I find all this fascinating. All the free programs I mentioned are great at what they do, and my thanks to the team and authors.

- Andy

[AndyT]

Sorry one other thing is that you can make fake sheets, lead sheets, easy play/large note, sing along etc all within musescore which is free.

- Andy