Initial thoughts on the CVP805

[Kenneve]

Hi Guys
I've now had my CVP805 for a week and am slowly getting grips with the differences, relative to my previous 605.
The new piano voices, CFX & Bosendorfer are superb, not that I'm a great pianist you understand! Many of the other instruments, Brass, Woodwind etc have been much improved, largely due, I think, to the improvements in digital sampling technology, I believe the the 605 was first marketed around 2011/12, and I think one word sume up the difference 'Clarity'. I keep looking around to see where the rest of the band is!!
I particularly like the Freeplay Styles where you are able to put your own feeling into the piece, also the addition of the drumkits to the Piano Room.

I'm a bit disappointed that the Musicfinder facility has been replaced by the Playlist, but I guess it's just a question of getting used to the new procedures?

As someone who uses headphones a lot, I find the output volume of the headphone sockets to be less than the previous 605, leading me to run with master volume flat out most of the time. I have been running with a pair of Sennheiser HD-201 phones for some years and last week I brought a pair of Yamaha HPH-100 phones to compare.
Certainly they are more than adequate as regards volume, but to my mind not as clear in definition as the Sennheisers and by comparison a bit bass heavy. So what I need is the level response of the Sennheiser phones but a bit louder

Perhaps someone can recommend headphones specfically for using with keyboards. Righty of wrongly i'm under the impression that wireless headphones have a slight delay in transmission, between hitting the key and hearing the note, so obviously prefer the wired version.

Overall I'm very pleased with the purchase and look forward to many hours of 'tinkering'.

[bmarcill]

  hello  Kenneve


   can you send us the styles and voices
 
  please

  ben

[Nocturne64]

Hello, congratulation for your new purchase. Very good choice. Please note that most Sennheiser headphones are not so easy to drive due to high impedance, and this is the reason for which you hear a lower sound volume compared to other headphones. But, as you said, Sennheiser quality is high.... I add: VERY HIGH! I'm using Sennheiser from many years and I would not change with any other brand. So, a good solution could be a good headphone amplifier connected between piano and headphone. You connect CVP805 line out to amp line in, and connect your headphone to amp out. Doing so, not only you will listen louder, but, most important, BETTER! Thanks.

[mikf]

I have a CVP 705 and the sound volume was so poor on all of my headphones compared to my 605, including the pair supplied with the keyboard by Yamaha, that I called a service technician. He agreed it was poor, but was unable to find any fault and concluded it was a design fault. It has never been resolved and a nuisance. So I am not so sure the problem is in your headphones.
Mike

[frajag]

The output from a headphone jack varies from instrument to instrument so it is not surprising to hear about these variations. You can solve this by using a headphone amplifier (about $50 on Amazon). If you are more adventurous then you can source from the usual sites in China or build from a kit. Yes, another piece of equipment !

[Kenneve]

Thanks guys for your comments and suggestion re headphone amps. I went for the 805 because i considered it to be better value for money than the 809 and couldn't afford anything better.

it looks as though the headphone problem is a carryover from the 705. I would certainly like to continue using my Sennheiser phones which I know and love, so I have been looking today on Amazon and came across an amp, that is USB powered, so presumably it could be powered by the 2nd USB socket under the piano keyboard? This would avoid separate power problems and power on, with the piano.
This socket is currently populated with a 2nd USB stick supplied by the dealer, containing several hundred RGT files, but I guess I could use a USB splitter?
Alternatively, if anyone has a recommendation for a suitable amp then please let me know.
If I connect using Line out, does it kill the speakers and does the main volume control still function?

[Nocturne64]

Hi, I do not suggested USB powered and so cheap amplifiers. You could not solve your problem. Look at amp specifications, and check the amplifier output impedance value. It must be around 300 ohm to be able to correctly drive good headphones like most Sennheiser. Not sure a cheap, USB-powered device can do it well. If you choose this solution and want to use some USB switch, choose one with its own power supply. If not, CVP805 could not provide enough current for powering all devices (amplifier, keys....). Also, CVP805 line out is not under piano volume control, so you must turn down piano volume and use volume knob on the amplifier to get the best volume when listening via headphone. Hope this helps.

[mikf]

I agree with Nocturn, not a good idea to use a USB amp. Before you buy anything, try this, its what the service tech suggested and is a good workaround.
Go to the menu, then select mixer. At the top of the screen you should see a tab 'master'. Select it and it opens up the master compressor. (This is on a 705,  if your screen looks a little different just look for master compressor or master.) Set the compressor to on, then go to the little box to the right of it and select. It will open a set of choices like 'moderate', 'live' etc  Select 'Volume boost'. You should see the gain go to about +15. If not try setting it to 15 manually. Then try to play through your headphones. Your problem should be solved. There will be little or no effect on sound quality, but you will have more volume. If it is still too quiet, or too loud, change the gain. But dont go too high or you may start to effect sound clarity and quality. 
Mike

[Kenneve]

Mikf, you are a star !! problem solved.
Pressing Mixer & Compressor- On, i'm presented with 3 controls:- Compressor/Texture/Output.
These have preset values labelled, :-  Natural/Rich/Punchy/Electronic/Loud/User 1.....
The default was Natural, giving values of:- Compressor 28/ Texture 65/Output 62.
Changing the preset to Loud gave values of:- Compressor 52/Texture 17/Output 48
This was marginally louder, but i noticed the the Output level had actually gone down
So, I returned to the Natural preset and simply raised the Output level to 77 and saved this setting under User 1.

I now have adequate volume, with also the ability to easily return to the Default setting, should I need to.
To reiterate, all that has changed is Compressor :- On, Output raised to :- 77
I'll now run like this for a few days, with my favourite Sennheisers and see how we go, thanks again for your help.

[mikf]

Interesting that your screen was so different for the 805 from the 705, but you seem to have successfully managed. Would have been interesting just to select the choice 'loud' and see what it does, and what values it has. My guess is that it is the equivalent of the 'volume' setting I use. The reason I suggest trying it is that is that it has been set by the experts. BTW, if you do select 'loud' the keyboard will retain that setting even when you switch off.
Mike

[Kenneve]

As I said, the 'Loud' setting made very little difference to the overall volume.
I guess my 'Output' control is the equivalent of your 'Volume' control, which I think makes sense, Certainly it seems to have the most effect on overall volume.
The attached photo shows the Master screen, edited to the new levels, saved as User1

[attachment deleted by admin]

[Kenneve]

Another minor shortcoming of the 805 is the time taken to start up
With the general improvements in technology one would have expected it to start up quicker, in fact I've just timed it at 22 seconds, (Power button to everything live), quite a bit slower than the 605.
However i'm still impressed with it, particularly now i've got the headphone volume sorted, It's just like the band is in the room with me

[Kenneve]

Hi Guys
I've now had the 805 for a few week and I'm still in love with it  , still slowly getting grips with all the new Styles & Voices.
As I said in my opening post, i found the Freeplay Styles particularly interesting.
These are Styles without any rhythm, and which can be played at your own speed.

The new demonstration video by Graham Blackledge of Rimmers Music, suggests that there are 11 such Styles on the 809, but I'm not sure how many are on the 805.
So far I have found 5, ie:- Ethereal Movie / On Broadway / Organ Hymn / Movies Horns / Elec Organ Ballad.
Graham demonstrates a song, using 80s Chill Out, which I've not yet found.

Can anyone tell me how many Freeplay Styles, the 805 has and where to find the additional Styles, to those listed.
I've ploughed through the Owners and References manuals, but no joy!

Many thanks.

[Toril S]

You can also download freeplay styles from PSR Tutorial. Go into styles section and look through styles from different keyboard. The freeplay styles are mostly found in the Movie&show cathegory.

[EileenL]

Use the search function to find styles it is very good.

[Kenneve]

Hi Eileen

Accept what you say about the Search function, but I can't see any way of locating Freeplay Styles, short of testing each one individually for no rhythm.
I guess the same problem applies to Toril S's suggestion of searching the PSR Style lists, unless of course anyone knows different?
Maybe I should put a request in PSR Styles section for any examples?

[EileenL]

Hi
  You should see freeplay over the top of the style. Look in Movie section for ethereal which is one. Yoy should see it marked as FP

[Kenneve]

Just had a reply back from Yamaha Support, saying there are 7 Freeplay Styles on the CVP805
I've found 6 of them but can't find one called 'Brass band' which is located in the March/Polka section.

Had the 805 about a month now and i'm still in love,

[Ray]

Hi Ken, Firstly many thanks for the EQ screen shots you posted under different heading. You asked why I went for the 809 over 805. Firstly, as I said on a very early post, I have moved from a Tyros, now Genos, which I would have preferred, to the Clavinova . Now because we now have two Burmese indoor cats, and can't have them running or jumping on the exposed top of a keyboard, the Clavinova having the piano closing lid solves that issue, and having the Genos engine, suits well. The 809 over the 805, mainly for the larger screen, as my eyes are not the best as I read music, (not easy play) and some print can be small. I can't play by ear., as it is, I have two thick books behind a supporting cardboard sheet, against the music rest, to bring the music a bit closer to read. I'm very impressed with the instrument, as I was with the Tyros few years back, it certainly is a nicer furniture piece than a keyboard , as my Tyros on the metal stand. Thankyou for help with a EQ, Ray.

[Kenneve]

Many thanks for your reply
Understand what you say about screen size etc, but I have to say it seems an expensive way of getting a larger screen.
Here in the UK the CVP805PE retails around £4700, whereas the CVP809PE is nearer £8000.

Have just been watching an Ozzie video by Piano City, Gold Coast, where they have what looks like a 42" monitor screen linked to the piano, to show the score of the song being played. I would thought it would have been cheaper to rig up a suitable size flat screen monitor on your music stand to achieve a similar result, accepting of course that the setup may look a bit messy.

I also find it is very useful to have good illumination of the music, see attached pic, which shows my setup with two LED striplights over the music.
These are just a couple of desk-lights brought from the local DIY store.

Anyway I hope my recommendations, re EQ have been useful, let me know if i can help further, these 800 series machines are magic

[attachment deleted by admin]

[Toril S]

But the CVP has a cat proof lid! 😀😀❤️

[Ray]

Toril S, I bet I'm the first PSR poster to list cat proof top as another great spec. for this versatile instrument.

[Nocturne64]

Well, the best option would be keeping cats very far from this fantastic piano!

[MadrasGiaguari]

Dear friends,

with my CVP from many years I'm using Sennheiser headphones (HD430). Excellent sound.

If one looks for higher volume on headphones, I suggest to go in Equalizer/Edit/Total gain Adj., and lift the volume as desired: you can get a tremendous increase in volume, very easy.

Ciao,

Angelo

[Kenneve]

+1. Mine are HD201, many years old, but excellent quality.
One of my previous posts details the adjustments required on the mixer panel.

[MadrasGiaguari]

Dear Kenneve,

would you please share your impression about the built in audio system of CVP 805?

I'm talking about both power (for home playing, of course) and quality of the sound, with special attention to bass production (as we all know CVP 805 has a simplified speaker system as compared to CVP 809).

Thank you

Angelo

[Kenneve]

Hi MadrasGiaguari.

Thanks for your query, first let me say i have no real knowledge of the overall sound levels of the CVP809, so cannot truly compare the two pianos.
Obviously I have heard both pianos in the demonstration setting of numerous videos and the odd dealer, but cannot tell any significant difference in overall sound quality between the two.
Many years ago in my youth, I had a part time job at a top class HI-Fi shop selling equipment, so do know a bit about sound quality.

i can say that the 805 with its simplified amp/speaker system and  total of 130 watts of power, has more than enough power to 'blow your head off' in the average domestic setting, I guess the CVP809 wiil be somewhat louder, but hey who's counting?
My previous piano was the CVP605 and even that, with its 90 watt total power, was, in my view sufficient. I'm not a lover of heavy metal, 'thump thump' type bass, as i prefer a balanced sound output throughout the frequency range.

Having said all that, for me the biggest difference with my upgrade, is the sheer quality on the new voices, they are are more realistic, crisp, lifelike, don't know how best to describe it.
Its like being in the band/orchestra or whatever, you just don't need the sound to be over loud to get the  best enjoyment.
You will see in previous posts, that in deference to my neighbours, much of my playing is on headphones, but I do occasionally get the chance to 'let fly' and rattle the windows!!

May I suggest that you visit your local dealer, for a demo on both models, as in the end it all comes down to personal choice. Certainly I have no regrets in choosing the lower model, I just couldn't justify  the significant extra expense of the CVP809 for what are for me, only marginal improvements

I hope that my comments are helpful, but if you have any further queries, then don't hesitate to ask.

Stay safe and best regards Ken.

[mikf]

I have tested the 705 against 709 and I don't remember any startling difference in the sound quality. I don't know about the 809 vs 805. But bear in mind these keyboards are very expensive compared to sound systems, and even the cost difference between the -09 and 05 is huge. So if you wanted to improve bass or overall sound, that would be relatively low cost to add to the -05, much less than going to the 09. I have an nice external studio sound system attached and tucked away behind my 705, a left over from my previous PSR set up. But I have never felt the need to use it, because like Ken says, the sound is just fine, certainly plenty loud for home use.
The main additional cost component from -05 to 09 is the 'top of the range'  keyboard, and different cabinet, although in the 809 there might also be a bigger screen, and some more Genos type arranger features.
Mike

[MadrasGiaguari]

Thank you to all for the interesting explanations.

The reason for my question came from a test I did in a store, where I played CVP 805 for about two hours.

I must say that definitely enjoyed the superb quality of the new sounds (mainly the drum kits), same as the Genos has.

The only question I had was the speaker system, since I had the feeling that the sound reproduction was not real full on the low frequencies, as compared with my CVP 309, although of a much older technology. My feeling has nothing to do with loudness; just presence of the all range.

Thank you again

Angelo