V3sounds Yammex

[Bachus]

Anyone using the Yammex with his Genos?

How are the grand piano voices?
Is there a Steinway sample?

[SeaGtGruff]

I'd never heard of them until now. Since they appear to be showing their sound modules at the 2019 Musikmesse, I wonder how long they've been out? Their modules are available at Thomann and other places, so I guess they've been out for a while now?

[Bachus]

I'd never heard of them until now. Since they appear to be showing their sound modules at the 2019 Musikmesse, I wonder how long they've been out? Their modules are available at Thomann and other places, so I guess they've been out for a while now?

They been active for years

The modules are about 2 years old now..

Before that they started out with a desktop arranger module aimed at german folklore music to be used with an accordeon. The arranger module is only available on thegermam website due to the content mostlybeing uninteresting outside their area..

Their sound engine seems quite advanced.. combining sampling with modeling

The way yammex handles Genos expansion is quite smart, to the player it feels like playing local genos voices

[SeaGtGruff]

One thing I noticed about their piano samples is that they include different samples for different Note Off velocities. I don't think Yamaha users will be able to benefit from that because, as far as I know, Yamaha keyboards send fixed Note Off velocities of 0.

[Eric, B]

Musiker Lanze on the German Forum uses is:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sun7Pi8zV9I
Check it out
You can contact him.
He is a nice guy
Eric

[Joe H]

... The way yammex handles Genos expansion is quite smart, to the player it feels like playing local genos voices

There was a discussion awhile back about making "dummy" Voice Packs in YEM to call up the Voices in Yammex. 

I did this for my Motif Rack XS. (the Motif uses MSB 063) I routed the audio out from the Motif into the audio Aux input on my S970 so when I play the Motif Voices it is just like playing the S970 Voices. The Motif works just like having pack Voices.  Same with the Motif Performances.

Joe H

[Bachus]

There was a discussion awhile back about making "dummy" Voice Packs in YEM to call up the Voices in Yammex. 

I did this for my Motif Rack XS. (the Motif uses MSB 063) I routed the audio out from the Motif into the audio Aux input on my S970 so when I play the Motif Voices it is just like playing the S970 Voices. The Motif works just like having pack Voices.  Same with the Motif Performances.

Joe H

Yes, i remember, but we never really discussed the v3sounds quallity back then.
Seems v3 yammex is rather popular

[Bachus]

Its been 6 months..
Seems noboddy on these boards has bought a Yammex?

As indicated in my orriginal post, it might be interesting for the grandpiano's
A bossendorfer imperial 290 and A Steinway Model D

[musicman01]

Dear Bachus, I had a test of the Yammex V3 Sound XXL Sonority a while ago, my conclusion is good accordions the other souns are not bad but no improvement for the Genos sounds. I sent the V3 back. I have the Ketron SD 1000 sound module for more than 2 years and these sounds are a good addition to my tyros 5 before and now the Genos.

[RoyB]

Hello Bachus

I bought the V3 Yammex just over 4 months ago to use with my Tyros 5-76. However, I see that the model has now been updated to V3 Yammex XXL and that the new model has additional pianos (or at least different piano names) and more variations compared to the pianos on the Yammex model I bought. I don't know how the new model differs from the previous model in other aspects.

So, my comments relate to the original V3 Yammex rather than the current XXL model (although I expect the overall considerations and conclusions to be similar).

I have had it a few months but haven't had chance to use it very much up to now - so these are very much first impressions.

The Yammex connects via MIDI to the Tyros/Genos arranger (arranger MIDI A OUT to Yammex MIDI IN) or by a USB cable. You also need to connect the stereo Audio OUTs from the Yammex to your amplification system - connecting to the AUX-IN on the keyboard is probably the most convenient for most people. When connected in this way, the Yammex sounds can be selected to be played in any of the arranger's RH or LH parts.

However, if you want to use the Yammex sounds in recorded MIDI files you also have to connect the arranger's MIDI B Out to the Yammex MIDI IN. I haven't had chance to use the Yammex with MIDI files yet, but I expect there will be some quirks and limitations due to the MIDI transmit channels used. If you have a second MIDI keyboard used along with your Yamaha arranger and you also want to use the Yammex sounds on the second keyboard, as well as the MIDI connections and set up between the arranger and the second keyboard, you also have to connect the MIDI OUT from the second keyboard to the Yammex MIDI IN. So, a more complex MIDI set up with the Yammex will require some MIDI Merger and Splitter boxes.

All the Yammex samples are stored on the Yammex box. The Yammex voices are selected on the arranger by installing what I would call small 'stub' voice files on the arranger that link to the voice samples in the Yammex box. There are 2 types of 'stub' files that can be installed. The first way is install them as expansion voices, using YEM to install the Yammex 'stub file' voices in expansion memory on the arranger. Because these voice files are very small (the sound samples are stored in the external Yammex box), they take up minimal amount of your expansion memory. However, the YEM set up requires entering specific LSB and Program Number information for each sound bank, so it does require some work. However, you don't need to install them as expansion voices at all. Instead, it is easier to download a special file from the V3 web site that contains all the individual .vce voice files which you can then just copy onto a USB stick or into the User section on the internal drive in the arranger. You can then just select them as you would any other voice either directly from the USB stick or from the User section on the internal drive.

I haven't gone through each individual voice on the Yammex comparing them with the original Tyros voices (and I don't intend to), and I will not really be commenting on whether they are better or worse than the original Yamaha voices. I bought the Yammex to give me a few hundred more useable voice variation options (to choose from when selecting voices to use in a song) rather than specifically to improve on the Tyros internal voices. From what I've tried so far, I expect I will be finding some of the additional Yammex Pianos (acoustic and electric), strings and orchestral voices, organs and synth sounds to be of particular interest to me. I think I will probably prefer the original Tyros guitars and choir/vocal sounds to those in the Yammex

As a free alternative to the Yammex, if you are after additional voice variations, then CMS-Sounddesign have made a good selection of expansion voices freely available for download from their web site. However, unlike the Yammex, these will use up your expansion memory so that you can only load a limited selection of them at any one time.

In my opinion, the internal Tyros 5 acoustic pianos, when used in songs as an instrument part along with other voices, are just fine and mix in well (I expect it to be the same with the Genos). However, I do find them lacking if used as a solo piano. I've found the acoustic pianos on the Yammex to be a noticeable improvement on the Tyros 5 pianos in this respect. However, in my opinion, if you are considering buying the Yammex solely for its acoustic pianos, then I think it is an expensive option and probably not worth it. I expect that you would still get better concert pianos from buying some other alternative expansion piano pack, but the better of these are likely to have huge sound samples that will eat into your expansion memory not leaving much room for anything else.

I have previously said in a post on another thread that I don't think I will be buying another arranger keyboard unless someone comes out with one that is really different or innovative. The Yammex suits the purpose for which I bought it - that is, to give me several hundred additional (largely good quality) voice variations (with the benefit of improved acoustic pianos) rather than buying a new arranger, and so for me it justifies the expense and I am happy with it. However, if anyone wants it just to replace the internal Tyros or Genos voices with ones of higher quality, then I would probably say that overall it wouldn't achieve this, and that you need to evaluate it and think about it carefully, as it is a considerable expense that could easily disappoint if it doesn't provide the specific improvements you want.

I would also like to add my views on acoustic piano sounds. I fully expect there may be different opinions on this which I respect. Like yourself Bachus, I play purely as a hobbyist at home and for making home recordings. My view is that if you are aiming to use your keyboard to play solo piano extensively and you want a very high quality concert piano sound, then I would say that a Yamaha arranger (and probably any other arranger) is not the answer.

Firstly, I would suggest that the Yamaha Tyros and Genos keybeds limit what you can achieve when playing solo piano. Some of the posts above allude to possible reasons as to why this might be. I have a Roland FA08 connected via MIDI as a second keyboard. I find that if I play the main Tyros 5 concert piano sound as a solo piano on the FA08 (which has a decent hammer action keyboard), in my opinion there is more control and the Tyros piano sound takes on a completely new dimension compared to when I play it on the Tyros.

Secondly, if I want to play solo piano with high quality acoustic piano sounds, I think I would probably be looking for those which are generated by applying sophisticated modelling techniques to high quality PCM samples - such as those found on stage pianos from the likes of Yamaha, Roland, Kawai, etc.

In short, if you want a portable keyboard and if you like to play a lot of solo piano and want a really good concert piano sound, then I would suggest you need (i) a good quality 88-key graded hammer action keybed that suits you, and (ii) a high quality modelled PCM piano sample - in other words, a good quality digital (stage) piano.

When I was looking for a second keyboard to use with my Tyros 5, I initially wanted such an 88-key stage piano, and was considering buying a Roland RD800 or a Kawai MP7/MP11. In the end, I compromised and instead got the Roland FA08 workstation which has a good quality 88-key hammer action keyboard (which I like) and high quality SuperNatural modelled piano sounds as found on the Roland RD800 stage piano (which are far better than the Tyros pianos). I was surprised (and disappointed) that when Yamaha recently brought out their MODX workstations, in direct competition to Roland's FAxx models, they only used AWM2 for the pianos, rather than the superior SCM (modelled) pianos found on some of their CP stage pianos.

Regards

Roy
 

[Bachus]

Thanks Roy, for the extensive answer..

I am on par wit you..
If i buy the Yammex, its for more sound diversity, easilly accessible trough Genos
The piano question, comes mostly from the fact that i general prefer the warmer european piano models over the japanese yamaha ones.. the new xxl comes with a bosendorfer and a steinway piano..

I also use the ravenscroft on my ipad a lot... its also a very warm piano..

Personally, i am moving away from the more heavy hammer actions..
After 30 years of playing synth keybeds, i Still play more dynamic on a good fsr keybed then on my modx8..