Genos registration numbers fading away !!!!!!

[EileenL]

Well I have had my Genos from when it first came out and believe me the buttons have had a lot of use but are still as good as new. When cleaning my keyboard I only use a damp cloth and then polish up with a Micro Fibre cloth. I always use registration banks for my set ups so as you can imagine they do get a lot of use as do the multi pad buttons and still look as new.

[Lee Batchelor]

I do the same as Eileen. I only use a microfiber cloth and warm water, well wrung out. My numbers are stable for the moment, touch wood. (Lee is currently rubbing his head .)

[EB5AGV]

I do the same as Eileen. I only use a microfiber cloth and warm water, well wrung out. My numbers are stable for the moment, touch wood. (Lee is currently rubbing his head .)

We have here so far only two known cases of fading numbers so, yes, it may be just some isolate cases. But, sadly, I think that it is a matter of time all units will begin to manifest the problem if, as I suspect, is a manufacturing glitch. I also care a lot my Genos and don't use anything which may damage its surface, just distilled water (so there is no residue) and a soft cloth. But even doing that, when you press any key, there is some light abrasive action on them by our fingers, even if slight, which will remove some paint molecules... When you repeat that thousand times, if the material is not strong enough, it will fade. I have seen that on professional items which painting on them, as I worked on R&D on an electronics manufacturing company which used some painted keypads. Repeat use can kill even the most resistant paints.

And, on Genos, there is no protective layer over the buttons. Which gives me a hint  ... Perhaps placing some transparent film on the keys will prevent them to fade. If we could find a suitable material, soft, easy to cut... Similar to old (non-glass) mobile phones protectors... May we have a chance to protect them before damage is done?. I would sacrifice somewhat (it could be made so it would be almost invisible) the looks if they are durable enough. At least for most used buttons, as registration ones. Just an idea! 

Jose

[Robert van Weersch]

It seems to me that the fading is not related to cleaning, but an effect of wear due to  usage, possibly combined with the specific composition of sweat and finger grease (which is different for each person). I've had several Yamaha devices, of which the longest period, a PSR 620, spanned more than 15 years. And it had no faded text anywhere, despite dragging it around to rehearsel rooms weekly, gigs and almost dayly usage. Actually, I've never had faded text on any keyboard, whatsoever. Quite embarassing that they messed this up on a TOTL device, which (did) cost(s) EUR 4000+.

[elad770]

Unfortunately I have a similar problem with fading "Song" button on my Genos (end 2017).

I have an idea: DO NOT PLAY SONGS! 

[panos]

The extinction of letters on keyboards in our times.
Oh my God...This is Genoside!

[Toril S]

LOL😀

[Al Ram]

Well ... . . Yamaha replaced the registration buttons that were fading away.  That is good.

The bad news (for me) is that now the HOME button is also fading away !!!!!!

I will contact Yamaha Monday to see what can be done about it . . .

Will let you know.

thanks

[EB5AGV]

Well ... . . Yamaha replaced the registration buttons that were fading away.  That is good.

The bad news (for me) is that now the HOME button is also fading away !!!!!!

I will contact Yamaha Monday to see what can be done about it . . .

Will let you know.

thanks

I am afraid ALL buttons will fade sooner or later. And that is bad for all of us, Genos owners 

Jose

[Sergey Kadyrov]

We know that there're famous building toys called "LEGO". In the past I reviewed some of them. Despite of the reputation of a high quality product, in recent years it was rather common that some sets had missing parts, some painted elements (like faces) were easily scratched away, some specific parts (like remote controls) were too smelly.

You could order replacements free of charge, but can you imagine that you buy for your kid a big and expensive set on a Christmas or birthday, and during assembly (s)he realizes that (s)he can't build the toy because some parts are missing? Coincidentally LEGO had decided as well that moving some productions to China will be a right thing to do.

We can assume that the rule in this business is "eat or be eaten". Maximizing profits is not necessarily a result of a greed, because each company has to keep innovating as hard as they can, spending on it as much money as they can.

A consumer wants something new every day and the company which fails to satisfy this need is momentarily comes closer to bankruptcy, regardless of its today's position. And we know that once a company starts to move in that direction, they try to sell their products for even higher prices.

As for the fading titles on Genos I'd say this. In my view, Genos is an expensive, yet not luxurious product. Unlike some acoustic grand pianos, or even stage pianos like CP1, it's mostly a very practical thing. You are not paying for its looks or some handicraft, mostly you are purchasing the software within.

As I understand, most of ordinary acoustic upright pianos cost more than Genos. Making an analogy with cars, I'd say, Genos is not Mercedes, BMW or some Lexus. It is a contemporary car which is a top of its own line, but it's intended to be priced within certain limits. Yamaha produces instruments for practical needs, not for private collections. This goes for LEGO toys which I mentioned above. They are expensive, but they are supposed to be bought by majority.

I guess CP1, or even CP73/88 are more about their appearances than Genos. But they are less fun. While I share your feelings, I guess we have to compromise on it. After all, an arranger keyboard is supposed to get dated rather fast. Just judging by how much the discussions are focused now on Genos now and all the previous models are now in a shadow it's easy to picture that in few years all the attention will be focused on something new. So what's left is to get what you can from this product today keeping in mind that in few years it won't be this exciting even with a brand new look.

[Lee Batchelor]

Interesting points, Sergey.

It's equally interesting that the Tyros series was in the same class as you describe, and yet, their buttons never faded. If Yamaha has to use inferior buttons just to survive in the musical instrument world, then their finances must be in terrible shape. There are other ways they could save money other than using buttons that fade. Unfortunately, this is becoming a trend these days. When quality control goes right out the window with companies like Yamaha and Honda (don't even get me started on that off-topic) who used to be at the top of the pile, we're in trouble.

For users, the buttons are one of the most critical parts of the keyboard. It's like buying a car and the steering wheel slowly turns to soft rubber over a few years. We need robust labeling that stands the test of time as it did in the Tyros series. Just think of what faded buttons will do for the trade-in value .

[JohnS (Ugawoga)]

Hi Lee
There is a lot of hoo haa about these buttons
I reckon it was a bad batch that sometimes escapes quality control
I have looked at mine here in the UK and they look well protected.
Anyway Yamaha would replace them for sure as for some it is a manufacturing fault

All the best John   

[Lee Batchelor]

Agreed, John. So far, my buttons are as good as new. It is definitely possible for a bad batch to reach production. You're right, I'm sure Yamaha would step up to the plate and fix the problem.

[Al Ram]

FYI

I contacted Yamaha USA and explain the problem .. . . .  I believe maybe i got a bad batch of buttons.

I asked for ALL printed buttons to be replaced.  Not only the ones fading.

Yamaha said they did not have any other reports except mine.   They opened up a case and asked me pics which i sent this morning.

They said will research and let me know their decision.

I will keep you informed.

thanks

[Bud2]

They should replace them all if it is a bad batch, it would cost them nothing in comparison to the bad reports they would get from people who had to suffer a bad batch which were not replaced.
Bill

[Al Ram]

Bill

You are absolutely right.  !!!!!

I contacted Yamaha and told them about the new buttons that are fading .. . .  I also said that i thought i had a bad batch of buttons and asked to replace them all . . .

Well not all, but all the buttons that have letters or numbers on it . . . . I count something like 42 (i do not have the Genos in front of me right now but i think i counted 42 total)

Yamaha opened up a case and after a couple of days they said they have extended the warranty until the end of this year 2019.   Labor and parts free of charge . . . . however, their email did not specify if i could take the keyboard and have them change all buttons at once or if it would be on a case by case basis . . . 

I called back to clarify but have not been able to connect.

This is really good from Yamaha because my one-year USA warranty actually expired early January 2019.

To me that means that i could take the keyboard now to replace the couple of buttons that are fading . . . . on the other hand, i might just wait until November to take them all at once . . .

Still thinking about it . . .

Thanks

[Cheshire Chris]

I'm surprised to hear that Yamaha only offer a 1-year warranty in the US. In the UK the warranty period is 5 years! I wonder why there's such a huge difference?

Best wishes,

Chris

[tyrosaurus]

I'm surprised to hear that Yamaha only offer a 1-year warranty in the US. In the UK the warranty period is 5 years! I wonder why there's such a huge difference?

Hi Chris,

The standard Yamaha Guarantee for most keyboards sold in the EEA (which includes UK) is currently 24 months.

https://uk.yamaha.com/en/support/warranty/index.html     

https://download.yamaha.com/files/tcm:39-627776#page=32   (opens PDF at UK start page)

As the page at the above link shows, Yamaha does have some extended warranty campaigns which offer up to five years total cover, but currently the only 'keyboard' instruments included in these are AvantGrand and Clavinova (CSP/CLP/CVP) pianos.

I think that you will find that the five year warranties that some UK dealers are currently offering, are actually the standard Yamaha one for the first two years, followed by a further three years support from the dealer.  The extent of cover during the final three years may be different from that offered by Yamaha, and of course assumes that the dealer is still in business then!

Still worth having though!


Regards

Ian

 

[Cheshire Chris]

Thanks for clarifying that, Ian. I currently have a Yamaha P-515 digital piano, and that has a 5-year guarantee. I seem to recall it got extended to 5 years by registering the instrument with Yamaha.

Best wishes,

Chris