Buzz on headphones

[JohnS (Ugawoga)]

Hi

Does anyone know what causes heaphone buzz when Cubase Is open and a feint like tape  hiss if up loud
I use a focusrite 6i6 sound box and a fast modern I7 computer.
Using my AKG headphones i need the focusrite up quite a bit to get normal listening.
Once i have the Ins and outs all ok  and an audio track  i get a sound like a record starting ,just background hiss, hardly audible though but noticeable.
Also I notice a slight noise when moving my computer mouse. Like a zip when you move it ,not loud again but noticeable.
So all this is from same scource then.
I already have a hum destroyer on my yamaha DX8's and that stopped that buzz.

I  take out the jacks at back of Genos and replace with my focal Alpha speakers .

So then I have out to Focusrite 6i6 and then to the focal Alpha's.
I think now that i may be picking up interference from my computer somehow
Does this mean I need another hum destroyer???

I think it is interference from computer. I can cope with it  but I noticed it and bothered me a little as i would like a clear signal.
Normal listen level it is ok


All the |best
john

[2112]

This type of buzz is usually called by one of two problems:

1) the main computer power supply is running close to the maximum available power. In that just upgrade the power supply to something much more powerful.

2) the box/case for the computer isn't properly shielding the radio-frequency interference. Is your computer case one of those fancy ones with meshes and see-through windows? Did you assemble all the metal shielding parts that the motherboard came with? Many self-assemblers omit some shielding parts for the hope of better cooling. It may work for gamers, but doesn't work for musicians.

Edit: which reminded me of the 3rd most common problem: if you actually hoped to use your computer also for gaming and installed powerful graphic card, then that is the most likely source of the interference. Those beasts are noisy not only in the acoustically but also electronically.

[JohnS (Ugawoga)]

Hi 2112

My computer was built by PC Specialist UK especially for music.
I have just a black sturdy casing and an I7 6 core built last year. I have plenty of power. It has a Nvidia Ge Force GT1030 graphics card
i have just checked in device manager and It needed an update. I do not know whether that is the problem. i'm not a computer geek.Just a humble user.
I am strictly not a gamer.
I had a buzz on my DXr8s which I use for playing normally and put a Behringer hum destroyer on that and It cured the buzz.
I have to take the Genos jacks out the main outs of the DXr8's and put the jacks in that go to my Focusrite 6i6 and then that goes to the Focal Alpha 50s. I have a usb to computer from the focusrite.
So DXR's for coloured sound and the Focals for monitoring.

all the Best
john

[2112]

Nvidia Ge Force GT1030 graphics card

Well, the graphics cards are the most common source of interference, and it seems like this is the case since you can hear the mouse moves in your headphones.

So basically they sold you a 6 core CPU and 384 core GPU. The available pictures on the web show both fanless and fanned versions. But both versions look quite beefy and are current top-of-the-line architecture for gamers: "Pascal."

I always advise people to buy computers with on-the-motherboard video for doing audio work. I wasn't ever proven wrong, but I'm not up to date with the recent market developments.

Can you post the exact motherboard part number?

Edit: Also: is all your equipment plugged into the same grounded power strip?

[Toril S]

I follow this with interest. I use a Focusrite with a win 10 Acer Aspire ultrathin laptop. No hum. But I only use Audacity for recording.

[JohnS (Ugawoga)]

Hi 2112

I have two power strips and are separate.
The Dxr 8's with hum destroyer are in one board  with the focusrite and focal alphas. The Focals are not connected to a hum destroyer and my computer is In another socket

My Motherboard Is            ASUSTek COMUTER INC>PRIME X299-A(LGA 2066 R4)   running at 27 degrees
Got that with Speccy

All the best
john

[JohnS (Ugawoga)]

I follow this with interest. I use a Focusrite with a win 10 Acer Aspire ultrathin laptop. No hum. But I only use Audacity for recording.

Hi Toril

I suspect it has something to do with the mains as the hum destroyer  worked on my DXR's
I have two computers in same room ,one for internet main and the other soley for music and mixing.
It is not a big deal as you get the interference when playing at higher volumes .
I just hope It does not get in the recordings. I dont think it would though as everying is digital.

All the best
john
I

[Toril S]

Hope you solve it Your posts are exitingly full of techy stuff. I love it

[2112]

Thanks for the accurate information.

ASUSTek PRIME X299-A

I asked for the exact model number because they will frequently upsell people by disabling onboard video and sticking some low-end video card. Unfortunately, you've got no onboard video.

What you've got is a high-end gamers board designed for operation with two graphics cards!

Behringer hum destroyer on that and It cured the buzz.

So this looks like they sold you ill fitting shoes and then upsold you crutches when you complained that you are limping.

Personally, I would just try to return computer for refund and run away from the vendor. All the audio parts that you have are more than decent, there should be no strange noises in the audio signals whatsoever.

Did you buy your box in the face-to-face transaction or ordered for delivery? Have you seen their shop? Was that a quiet place with soundproofing or some loud gaudy shop for bass-freaks and unibrow ringtone artists with Harley-Davidson motorcycles parked upfront? The ASUS marketing materials call them "professional content creators and power users who work hard by day and play harder by night."

I don't think you are ever going to be happy with this box.

If you are somehow stuck with this purchase: borrow another low-end computer from somebody. Plug it in a different room and verify one by one what works quietly and what doesn't. Don't install Cubase or any other advanced applications. Just use the default "SoundRecorder.exe" to record and playback two channel test tracks.

[JohnS (Ugawoga)]

Hi 2112
Pc Specialist are a big company North of England with a good reputation and yes I got it online.
I do not know what to think as I have had this computer for a year now  and has been doing ok
These slight noises are more noticeable at higher volume and not at  low level listening.

Ok thanks for the info

All the best
John

[2112]

Pc Specialist are a big company North of England with a good reputation and yes I got it online.

The good reputation amongst whom? Do they sell to people recording classical music audiophiles or do they sell to the crowd that listens to their music on smartphones?

Technically your box is a high-end gaming machine with only one graphic cards plugged in where two are expected. It completely doesn't make sense technically. If you maybe read a good reviews of this box, it was because of bribes, not because of any real quality.

This motherboard was especially designed for top-of-the line gaming boxes for the two main graphic card vendors:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scalable_Link_Interface
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AMD_CrossFireX

It is like selling you a 12-cylinder sports car and only installing 6 spark plugs because you won't be racing, only driving to church on Sundays.

I never used this particular board but some older ones with similar on-board audio section: in a separate metal shield and additional built in voltage regulator. They had better-than-the-CD quality right in-the-box, there was no need to buy any out-board gear to record 2-tracks at a time and produce 5.1-track mix; which was what we mostly did.

Have you actually tried direct audio-in and headphone-out straight to/from the motherboard?

If you just looking for somebody to tell you "buy more crutches" (sorry, Behringer Hum Destroyers), it is not going to be me. Those devices never make sense in any studio work, even if it is a home studio. They are good for e.g. gig at a pub where you get electrical interference from the beer refrigeration equipment; or similar situation where tickets were sold and the show must go on.

Sorry I wasn't able to help you more. I kinda like playing with electronic gear, but I'm never going to care about "reputation" when the proof-in-the-pudding stinks.

Edit: Added links to Wikipedia.

[MarkF_48]

Hi John,

- The USB cable you use to connect the Focusrite 6i6 to the computer, does it have a ferrite choke in the cable. It will be a fair sized lump or two somewhere in the cable. It would look like this....    https://www.amazon.com/Tripp-Lite-Hi-Speed-Ferrite-U023-006/dp/B003MQ29B2
Your interface is powered off a wall wart rather than USB bus powered, so a ferrite choke type cable may or may not help with the noise you're getting (the ferrite chokes block or helps block electrical noise that may come the computer through the USB cable).  Fairly cheap to give a try.

- Also how long is the USB cable? Focusrite suggests 2 meters or less.

- Make sure the most up to date drivers are installed for the 6i6. You mention having to have the headphone volume up quite a bit. Does the 6i6 have a 'mixer' panel where levels can be set and if so, can levels be set within there to send more volume to the headphones?

- If other audio cables are plugged into inputs or outputs, does removing any or all of them change the noise you get?

- The proximity/nearness of the interface to other computer gear (monitor for example) might possibly radiate noise into the interface. If some of the equipment can be moved around a bit see if it affects the noise.

- If the computer was built on a gaming machine platform, would you know if it is set to 'overclocking' either automatic or manually (usually set in the BIOS). The builder of the PC may know if he set it that way.

- From another board I'm on, Focusrite seems to be good at responding to inquiries of problems people have with their gear. It might be worthwhile shooting them an email describing your issue and see if they can help.

[overover]

@ugawoga
Hi John,

noises that occur when you are moving the mouse pointer or "ticking" noises probably come from the PC.

But if you also have some Hum Loop (= Ground Loop) problems, I recommend to check the following:

All Output jacks of Genos are UNBALANCED "TS" jacks. Therefore, BALANCED Audio cables ("TRS to TRS" or "TRS to XLR") can NOT be used! (At the Genos' Output jacks, the "Ring" contact is NOT CONNECTED.)

Only UNBALANCED Audio cables can be used ("TS to TS"). ("TRS to TRS", "TRS to XLR" or "TS to XLR" can only be used if XLR pins 1 and 3 are bridged or "Ring" and "Sleeve" of TRS plugs are bridged!).

To avoid Hum/Ground Loops (especially when using unbalanced cables), the Genos should be connected to the same power source (same electrical phase) e. g. the same power strip where also the computer, the Audio interface and a external mixing console are connected.

I also recommend to test if the Hum/Noise disappears when all MIDI and USB cables are disconnected from the Genos.

If you still have a Hum/Ground Loop problem with Genos, I recommend to try a DI Box (very short "TS to TS" cables from Genos Output to the DI box and BALANCED (XLR) cables to the Audio interface). Most DI Boxes have a "Ground Lift" switch. This switch should be tested in BOTH positions.


Hope this helps!


Best regards,
Chris

[JohnS (Ugawoga)]

Hi
Thanks Mark and Chris for your help
I think I have solved the problem . I will test again later as I stayed up late sorting this out.
2112 may have had some good points which i taken aboard, but found some comments a little harsh.
A week ago things looked ok.
I started reading about balanced and unbalanced lead jacks.  I had balanced cable from the Genos to my Focusrite 6i6.
I was thinking that I had the wrong lead In, so i changed back to unbalanced  from Genos  to Input of Focusrite which is balance Input.
But from what i have read  balanced cable coming out of the Genos to sound box  does not matter as the lead will act as an unbalanced lead anyway.
Well I had now gone back to balanced which I had in the first place. Checked my cables. I may have had dodgy lead or leads.
I found out my Graphics card needed updating and also checked speaker lead layout.
All was clear as a bell again last night .
I will check again today when i have woken up.
Now I can get on with It


All the best
John

[2112]

2112 may have had some good points which i taken aboard, but found some comments a little harsh.

Sorry, didn't mean to offend. I always prefer direct communication over trying to emulate Château de Versailles on the Internet.

Hopefully someone will find this thread via a search engine and find the technical information useful. It really can be summed up as follows:

When linking Yamaha Genos to any computer use S/PDIF digital audio interface. For the price of one correct cable you'll get perfectly clean sound. Don't get suckered into buying any outboard gear.

[JohnS (Ugawoga)]

Hi
I realise now that too much gain increaes the noise floor wth a sound interface.
I will look at getting a higher recording before converting to wave.
I am getting to grips with this mixing slowly and getting to -3 db is my goal for a finished track.
Now you have to consider LUfs for putting your tracks on different sites.
It's all a worry !!!


All the best
John

[MarkF_48]

Good article here on gain staging (setting levels between gear) ....... https://www.sweetwater.com/insync/gain-staging/