Need Correct way to Save Music Finder file to USB on Tyros 5

[cthiggin]

Hello folks,
So happy to be a new member and posting for help.

I have had my Tyros 5 since Oct. 2017.  It came from the dealer with 1823 records in the MF.
After watching instructional videos and reading manual, Google searches for  info, I started assembling new songs, styles, instruments, tempo, etc., and then saving to the MF by
pressing the Style Box on my screen, then "Add to MF" -  all has worked well.

Since Jan of 2018, I had saved approx. 425 new songs to the MF and all was just fine.
Weekly, I would open MF, then press the "Files" Tab, and save the MF to my internal HD and USB, for safety.

Last week, I went to add a new song in the MF, through proper ways (Style Button, then Add to MF) and I then got a pop-up that stated ?? cannot save to MF due to low memory.

I then cancelled and exited out.  I then went to MF, Files Tab, and saved the MF File to my internal HD and USB.  Upon completion, I then pressed the MF to play another song and
then "I almost passed out time" I showed only 137 MF Files.  I tried restoring from HD and USB, and still only 137 files.  I looked at my saved MF file on my USB and it only show
the size of 12k.

Well folks, I do NOT  know what happened, but I have to start back after losing 1 years worth of files.  I WAS able to restore the MF to the original 1823 files that came from the dealer.

I have read the owners manual, searched on line, Googled, and I am getting conflicting methods to save the MF File.

1.  States that you go to Function / Utility / Music Finder reset to ADD New file and to SAVE new file.
2.  States that you go Open MF, then go to the Files Tab, and then Save / or / Add / Append / Replace.

PLEASE help me to save the MF using the correct method.  I don't want to lose a years worth of work again.  At 71, I may not live long enough to rebuild.

THANK YOU for reading this long winded post, but you help would be highly appreciated.

Blessings,

Tom (cthiggin)

[travlin-easy]

Hopefully, you still have your original, onboard MF in place and have not overwritten the file. If this is the case, you will be able to save it to any drive that you wish by going to Function/System Restore/Music Finder then select Save and provide it with a new name. This will save the new, updated file.

Now, if you have tried to recall a file from an older file, all bets are off and you have overwritten the updated file with an outdated file.

Good luck,

Gary

[cthiggin]

Hello Gary,
Thank you so much for your reply and help.  I called Yamaha Support, took 23 minutes for a person came on, then I told him my issue and he said all of the 2 Reps were on calls and to leave my number and they would call back.  It's now approaching 3 weeks with no reply.

Gary, I just need an explanation of the two methods I have read about multiple times as I can't wrap my head around them.

1. (Initial way I was saving the MFD)  Each week, after saving many records for new music, I would A) Open MF  B)Click on Files  C) Save the MFD to both Hard Drive and USB.
    Evidently, this is NOT the correct way as I only had a MFD Original file (2200+ songs) that shows a 16KB file on both the Hard Drive and my USB.  I would NOT save it as a different
    name as you instructed.

2. The preferred way/your instructions (Always when saving or importing a different MFD)
    Open Function, Utility,System Restore/Music Finder - click on save AND PROVIDE A "NEW NAME" for the MFD - (and Import this original file or other MFD's the same way)

[Fred Smith]

Tom,

Have you ever had to restore a music finder from backup?

If saving the file is causing you so much grief, why bother?

I had Tyros keyboards for over 10 years, and the music finder files always stayed right where they were — on the hard drive.

I'm betting your life would be a lot simpler if you left the file alone. And for sure, do NOT save to the hard drive — it's already there!

Cheers,
Fred

[cthiggin]

Hello Fred,
Thanks for your reply
I have used the MF since I purchased the Tyros5 1.5 years ago.
I also have a lot of sheet music that I am individually setting up for styles / instruments/ tempo etc.  Once finished with a song, I save it to the MF.
Once a week, I would back up the MFD to my onboard hard drive, and to my USB, for safety.  This method works for me.

I am not stressed out, but want a method to properly save my updates, f or security.
As stated in my first thread here, I lost over 400 songs that I had set up since I purchased the T5. I get a screen that comes up and says cannot save file.  I exited the MFD, then
clicked on it and only had 137 Songs.  After much searching, I reloaded my base 1800 files.

Fred, all I am asking for is the correct safe method to backup the MFD.

1.Some users say to open the MFD, go to  files, and save on the hard drive or USB drive.
2.Other user say to open up the Utilities, go to MFD, AND then copy all the files, then save to USB or Hard Drive "As a different name"?

Thank you,
Tom

[Fred Smith]

I would do #1, but save only to the USB. Don't save to the hard drive, because it's already there. Saving to the hard drive runs the risk of overwriting another file. 

Cheers,
Fred

[cthiggin]

Hello Fred,
Thank you for your continued help and explanations.

OK - I will only use the #1 Method as you suggested (Fred, I think reading sooooooooooo much and all the searching, it becomes a blur and for me, confusing)

I've asked so many folks, even the company I purchased my Tyros from, and I have never been told that the Hard Drive "Holds - Preset MFD, User Files, etc. but they are
hidden where you can't see. So, in "our cases", ONLY Save on USB?

Thanks again friend,
Tom

[travlin-easy]

Tom, sorry that I have not been keeping up on this issue, but I have had some bad health problems lately and have not been able to spend much time on the computer.

As Fred said, back up your files to your USB drive, which should save you some grief. Be sure not to overwrite the existing file by providing the backup with a new file name each time.

One more thing, be sure to turn off the keyboard before removing the USB drive. Removing the USB drive from the keyboard when it is turned on can destroy the USB drive - I have done this a couple times and learned the hard way.

The instructions I provided above also apply to the USB drive stored files. It's just a matter of tabbing over to the USB drive to retrieve or save the MFD files.

Hope this helps,

Gary

[cthiggin]

Hello travelin-easy,
Thanks so much for your reply and help.

First and foremost, I hope and pray that your health issues get resolved soon.  2018 was a bad year for me. Sepsis and it has taken me over a year to recover, leaving some lung damage.
At 71, we don't bounce back like we once did.

All of the folks here that have responded have been a big help. I would like to make some statements of my understanding, and then you or folks can correct me.

1.Presets / Styles etc. - info is saved on the T5's hard drive - hidden?
2.Users presets are also saved on the Hard Drive?
3.On our T5s, what do we use the Hard Drive for?
4.I understand that we back up our MFD's to a USB.
5.When we "back-up" our MFD's, we go through MF/files - save it to USB with a different name, each time?

Hopefully, these assumptions will let me get my ol' head around the setup.

Thanks so much,
Tom

All in all, I think losing over 400 MFD records and blew a year of my time has made me real gun shy.  I just want to minimize the risk factors.

[tyrosaurus]

Hi Tom,

Files are not 'hidden' on the HDD of Tyros models!

However they are filtered from view according to the specific Selection Screen that is open.  Folders are always listed in a selection screen, whatever type of file they contain, but when it comes to files, only those of the type shown in the title of the selection screen are listed.  So to see for example, Style files, you must be in the STYLE selection screen, and to see MFD files, you must be in the MUSIC FINDER selection screen.  This is how the Yamaha OS works and is the case whichever drive you are using, even the Preset!

You can save MFD files on the User drive, USB, or the internal HDD in the case of Tyros models.

On your Tyros5 the HDD is the obvious place to store them since there is a huge amount of space (500 GB), and it is always connected (unlike a USB)!  However if you prefer to save to USB, then the points below about saving files with unique names still apply.

To keep things tidy and make them easy to find (and to see all of them together), you could create a folder called 'Music Finder' or similar and save backup copies to this.

It really depends on which is most convenient for you!

However, whichever drive you save to, if you use the same name and folder as a file that already exists, you will overwrite the previous version of the file.  If you do try to do this, then you will be warned that you are about to overwrite and asked to confirm that you want to do this, so it is not really something that you could do unknowingly by accident!

Note that each time that you power up the keyboard, the first time that you press 'FILES' in the MF, the selection screen will open at the Music Finder 'PRESET' page which only contains the original Preset MFD named 'MusicFinderPreset'.  This is really just a sample MFD which only contains a small number of records (135 on my T4 for example !) and is intended to demonstrate the MF function.

You can't save anything to the PRESET drive and you will see that the 'SAVE' icon is greyed out.  To save the current MFD you must navigate to USER, USB or HDD1 and then the Save icon will light up.  However the first time that you press it after you turn on the power, the name that will be used will be 'MusicFinderPreset' unless you change it, which I would say is essential to do if you want to avoid confusion later!

Once you have saved or loaded a MFD to the MF, pressing 'FILES'  will open the selection screen at the page for the drive/folder/file last saved or loaded.  This will continue to be the case until you turn off the power.

I suspect that when loading an MFD, you have somehow managed to load the Preset sample file  and thus ended up with only 137 records.  Presumably you then later saved the MFD thinking that what was currently loaded was one with all of your records!

There are times when you might want to back up a MFD that you have added a few records to since it was last saved, so you might be tempted to save it with the same name each time, but if you insist on doing this you should at least check carefully that the MFD currently installed is the one that you think, even if you only check that the 'NUMBER OF RECORDS' shown is as expected.

Saving a MFD does not remove or change what is currently loaded, so in the above scenario you could simply save a backup copy and change the name to include the date without needing to load the same records back to the MF.

The important thing is to make sure that each backup is saved as a new file rather than overwriting an existing one.  If you like, you can tidy things up every now and then by deleting some of the older backup MFDs that you are sure you no longer need, although with the massive storage space available on the T5 hard drive, there is not really any need to do so!

If you have ever saved one of your own MFDs to a folder on the HDD with a unique name, then it is likely to still be on the HDD!  However if you have accidentally saved it in a folder different to normal, it could be difficult to find using the keyboard.

I would suggest connecting the keyboard to a Windows computer in 'USB Storage Mode', and the T5 USB will then be shown in Windows File Explorer.  On the computer there is no filtering of file types as there is on the keyboard, so you can see everything, warts and all!

You can then select the drive and use Explorer's search function to look for ".mfd" or "*.mfd".  This should find all (or any?) MFD files on the T5 HDD. 

Who knows, you may be able to find a version with most of your modifications intact.  However if you have only ever saved MFDs in the same location and always used the same name, then you are probably out of luck! 

You can read how to connect the T5 to a computer in USB Storage Mode in the section 'Accessing an Internal Hard Disk Drive on the Tyros5 from the Computer (USB Storage Mode)' on page 104 of the Tyros5 Owner's Manual.  Note that if you try this, it can take a minute or two to connect to the computer, so be patient!  You can also use this mode to copy files from the HD to the computer as a backup and generally manage the HD, tidy up, etc.


Regards

Ian

[cthiggin]

Ian & others.
Thanks so very very much for you help and excellent instructions.
I can assure all of your expertise and keystrokes will not go un-used!!!!

Thanks so much and blessings,

Tom

[travlin-easy]

Tom, unfortunately, my health issues will not be resolved. I am dying of pulmonary fibrosis, which means I am slowly suffocating to death. I just have to live with the cards that I have been dealt.

I hope to continue to help forum members with the problems until I can no longer function. This may be just another six months, or maybe a bit longer, but not likely.

I am confident you will be able to get through these problems in the very near future and continue enjoying your keyboard.

All the best,

Gary

[cthiggin]

Gary,
I am very very sorry to hear of your exact health problems.
I am confident that you can help someone every day, as you have helped me.
You will be in my prayers friend.
Blessings,
Tom